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Fuel Joints

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richard(at)scarrhillalpac
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 12:34 am Post subject: Fuel Joints

Hi All,

  I am fitting the factory water drains to to my tank and wanted to know what is best to seal the threads where the joints screw together? My first thoughts are PTFE Thread tape, or a smear of Redux. Or is there something El's?



Thank You

Richard Wheelwright.

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josok-e(at)ukolo.fi
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 1:24 am Post subject: Fuel Joints

These are tapered threads eh? Just fit´m dry. Anything else will end up in your fuel filters or worse. 



Regards,



Jos Okhuijsen

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ptag.dev(at)tiscali.co.uk
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 1:56 am Post subject: Fuel Joints

Hi! Richard

You will find that they are tapered threads which are meant to be dry

assembled, PTFE tape is notoriously dangerous for contaminating the fuel

system no matter how carefully used. I actually use just a slight

"smidge" of Hilomar jointing compound but only to stop the grinding

feeling as the unions are tightened.

Regards

Bob Harrison.G-PTAG



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richard(at)scarrhillalpac
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 2:55 am Post subject: Fuel Joints

Jos & Bob

  Thank you for your quick reply. Good advice, I see the threads are tapered now. Thanx. 



The Manual instructs the fixing on the gauze into the tank fitting with Redux !!! I would take it from this that Redux is fuel resistant. I would like a neat job here, If anyone has any pictures I would greatful. ( With the factory Fuel drains)



Thank You Again

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josok-e(at)ukolo.fi
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:56 am Post subject: Fuel Joints

You are welcome 

And adding after the subject changes to restrainers:

After Bob told us about his emergency landing because of fuel starvation i decided to have no restainers at all. Bob's restainers were reportedly clogged by dog hair and lint. Quite understandable because the tank and snake material is highly static. Somebody remarked that pea size pebbles might block the opening. But since i do no expect pea size debris in the fuel i prefer to take that risk. On the other hand, i expect restainers to be checked only ant yearly intervals. I have been checking my gascolator every 5 hours till now, and have found a few hairs, and some tank cutting fiber, no further debris. 



Regards,



Jos Okhuijsen

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rparigor(at)suffolk.lib.n
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 4:52 am Post subject: Fuel Joints

Hi Richard



"I am fitting the factory water drains to to my tank and wanted to know

what is best to seal the threads where the joints screw together? My first

thoughts are PTFE Thread tape, or a smear of Redux. Or is there something

El's?"



As mentioned teflon tape is not a good idea. Besides chance of sending a

sliver somewhere especially if you ever remove and reinstall, it can

easily allow over tightening and break something, and perhaps not right

away!



Better off with no teflon tape dry than with.



That said, I began using just a little on threads, missing the first

thread all together of EZ Turn (Fuel Lube) purchased from Aircraft Spruce.

BTW I disassembled and very careful inspected supplied fuel selector, it

was OK and used EZ Turn to lubricate. There is more than one Cessna 150

that uses same valve that had instructor turn off fuel on student and have

it break closed. They can get very tight, best to keep lubed well. If you

find someone you don't like, put a smear of this wicked thick and

imposable to remove compound on their car windshield!



Then for majority of fuel system am using PTFE based thread compound,

again just a little and missing the first thread all together. This will

allow easy removal and install. After listening what Flowscan had to say

and my experience PTFE it is for me. 



There are some instances, like on fuel tank output nipple with copper

extension for mono water drain, I used Redux. If fit was not the greatest

I have added just a little flox to Redux. You can probably remove (heating

would help I am sure) but would limit to things you are pretty certain you

will never touch. that is not the case for water drains that will need new

O-Rings / and or complete replacement after a while.



Flowscan 201Bs on some Certified Aircraft installs recommend dry install

of pipe threads. Flowscan themselves (and some certified installs)

recommends PTFE based thread compound. They are very specific as to which

type of compound, think it is a Loctite product which is what I am using.

If you need let me know and I will look up part number.



Note DO NOT INSTALL ALUMINIUM FITTINGS on a Flowsacn 201B transducer. I

hand screwed in by finger dry a 45 degree fitting to choose one with

thread that would allow proper orientation, and it galled and took out

half the threads on way out. I was able to hand grind a bottoming tap even

further, and got back half of normal threads and Redux/floxed it in place.

Whew.



I suppose if you have an aluminium body something or other (gasculator or

fuel selector) you could probably get away with using an aluminium fitting

if you used EZ Turn or PTFE based thread compound (or Redux), but I would

not. Better off using Brass, Stainless or Steel fitting to ward off

galling. You can not believe how a hand tightening could weld together

aluminium so well.



Having a Mono, I installed copper tube to reach aft section of tank. I

used this as an advantage and made my gauze filter close to two times the

length of factory recommended length. Instead of using factory supplied

screen that is very course, I went to about half as fine and used some

stainless steel mesh from McMaster Carr. Without the copper tube it would

be too long to support itself I fear. Thus turned an aluminium spacer that

was Reduxed to the copper tube as a support for end of screen! I also did

a two time wrap of safety wire at end over aluminium again Reduxed, and a

token 2 time wrap in center. Wayne can't find some early build pics, this

included. I did a quick test and am pretty confident that I can borrow

some dog hair from PTAG, and not have it pass screen and clog nipple

inlet, yet course enough to let through what I want.



I have a picture posted at:

http://www.europaowners.org/modules.php?set_albumName=Begin-06-2003&op=modload&name=gallery&file=index&include=view_album.php

Under:

914 modular fuel system. Series with bypass, two Andair 375s. 

Of my water drain location. I made these with 1/8" NPT for inlet (and

sight gauge) and 1/4NPT for drain. Sight gauge will be for ground checking

only (nipple has restrictor in it). Have Factory float style reed switch

gauge for inflight.



Ron Parigoris

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rob(at)hyperion-ef.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 9:03 am Post subject: Fuel Joints

Others have answered your question but another point should be made.  I

found out that blindly following the factory's instructions, perhaps revised

since my installation, for the drain kit had me place the drains in the

wrong location.  It seems that the factory neglected to note the difference

in attitude (on the ground) of the Tri-Gear and I failed to notice that the

drains were in the wrong place (above the bottom of the tank) until after

the fittings were bonded in place.  Bummer.

Best regards,



Rob Housman

Irvine, California

Europa XS Tri-Gear

S/N A070

Airframe complete

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johnwigney(at)alltel.net
Guest

Posted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 4:55 pm Post subject: Fuel Joints

Hi Richard,



I think it is best to avoid PTFE tape for aircraft use. It is forbidden 

in the petrochemical industry. I believe there was one huge disaster 

which was traced to a loose piece of PTFE lodged in a pressure control 

valve.



Anyway, I recommend Hylomar Universal Blue (was PL32M), see 

http://www.hylomar.com/universal_blue_4.shtml, for fuel joints and 

gaskets. This has been around for a long time and was originally 

developed by Rolls Royce for gas turbine use. It does not set up hard 

and joints and threaded connections can be remade. A light touch only 

would be needed on the fuel drain fittings. It is tough to clean up and 

I find that a dab of methylene chloride on a rag will do the trick.



Also see 

http://www.silmid.com/search/search2.asp?keyword=Hylomar&product_line=%25SEA%25&heading=Hylomar 

and http://www.hylomar-usa.com/_resources/_html/order.html for order 

details.



Cheers, John

N262WF

Mooresville, North Carolina



ORIGINAL MESSAGE



Subject: Fuel Joints

From: "Flying Farmer" <richard(at)scarrhillalpacas.co.uk>

Hi All,

  I am fitting the factory water drains to to my tank and wanted to know what is

best to seal the threads where the joints screw together? My first thoughts

are PTFE Thread tape, or a smear of Redux. Or is there something El's?



Thank You Richard Wheelwright.

- The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum -

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List

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