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Lithium Ion Battery for OBAM aircraft project

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nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
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Posted: Sat May 11, 2013 11:09 am Post subject: Lithium Ion Battery for OBAM aircraft project

At 01:02 PM 5/11/2013, eric.boutteloup(at)laposte.net wrote:

 Good morning Bob,

  

 Thank you very much for your quick, documented and very interesting answer.

  

 1) I found, the information about voltage over 14.5V  on the link below (from ULM Technology a french dealer for ultra light airplane parts)  http://commerce.ciel.com/ulmtechnologie/Article/60193-X4_this.aspx ?

 The sentence (in french !!) at the bottom :

 â€Attention en cas de surtension supÃ©rieure Ã  14.5V, la batterie se dÃ©tÃ©riorÃ©e, dans ce cas, la garantie ne s'applique pasâ€



 Which means : Warning, in case of overvoltage above 14.5V, the battery become damaged, in this case, warranty will not apply.

  

 2) I just have had a look to the Aliant website and they say :



 Charging voltage



 14.4 V



 Maximum charging voltage



 14.6 V

  

 They also claim that :

 This family of batteries is indicated for the replacement of all types of lead batteries currently in use without making any changes to the electrical system in the vehicle. Refer to the online configurator to choose the suitable model.

  

 3) I am in the process of building a micro light Aircraft from a kit, a Nynja from Bestoff. So I cannot check yet the voltage of the Ducati regulator. On the 912UL2 installation manual, regarding the regulator (which is supposedly a Ducati one...) , it says: usefull voltage : 14 +/-0.3V (from 1000+/-250 rpm)

  

 In consequence it seams quite probable that this low weight battery can survive in my future 912UL2 electric environment, provided that the regulator do not over volt too long and too often above 14.6V.



     I agree. Since I responded to your query, I've

     discovered that the Aliant products utilize

     A123 cylindrical cells.  A123 filed for bankruptcy

     protection last fall



  http://tinyurl.com/cmy4xnj



     and seems to have received an influx of cash

     from a Chinese firm. I believe A123 was the

     supplier of cells to Cessna's Li battery program

     which has been put on the back burners pending

     recovery from a battery fire in a Citation on

     the ramp last year.



     I believe the Cessna battery used prismatic

     cells . . . 'rectangular bricks' as opposed to

     the cylindrical 'jelly roll' cells which seem

     to be less prone to the separator failures suspected

     of being root cause for the failures.



     Aha! Just ran across this statement from a document

     found at:



  http://tinyurl.com/c4hetul



 

 [/b]ALIANT compared currently with SSB Powersport/Haijue/Skyrich/Ballistic/Motocell/Shorai (Chinese cells)



 1) Up to 16 Models are required to stock. Aliant has only 6 different models to manage covering over 95% of motorcycle applications.



 2) Aliant product is made with A123 System cells-that means maximum safety and performance. The oldest and industry leading cell producer from the USA. Involved in Lithium technology since Space Shuttle.



 3) S kyrich, (SSB, Haijue) use Lithium Polymer cells not lithim iron phosphate technology-there are differences in terms of quality and safety as well as they can explode and catch fire when overvoltage and short circuit.



 It does not happen with A123 System cell as they meet the UL1342 testing. Published on www.Birdman.net.au website.



    I was unable to find any such testing protocol on

    the UL website at  http://tinyurl.com/brpeblz



    Further, a stroking of the search engines failed

    to take notice of "UL1342" anywhere except on the

    birdman website. I'll write to them for clarification.

    Maybe this is a typo.



    I did find a listing for UL2575, the only one that

    speaks to lithium batteries (for power tools).



 

 4) ALIANT have integrated BMS that allows the system to get fully charged with:

 * Motorcycle electric system without any change and can handle system failure with absolute safety.

 * A list of compatible chargers (Battery tender, Optimate Lithium, CTEK X800 and 3600)



 These features are not possible with other brands as there is no BMS inside, and you need to use a dedicated charger to charge the battery and make sure its ok. ALIANT extends battery life becuase it ALWAYS WORKS, both in charge and discharge, and maintains the cells at same voltages, balancing along the series of cells.



    It seems the Aliant products are fitted with a battery

    management system that takes care of housekeeping chores

    unique to lithium batteries. That's a different ball

    game. Even the little $3 Li-Ion batteries for my grandson's

    helicopter is fitted with a BMS.



 [img]cid:.0[/img]



    Internal management of lithium battery vagaries

    would go a LONG way toward making the product user

    friendly and a drop-in-replacement for legacy

    batteries.



    This explains the images I posted earlier suggesting

    that my plain-vanilla battery tenders are suited to

    service on Aliant products. The cylindrical cells

    may also go to improved separator performance.



    It does give pause to consider the admonition for

    a "14.5 volt limit" on charging voltage. An internal

    battery management system should be able to accommodate

    ANY charging voltage not wildly departed from that found

    in legacy lead-acid systems.



    In any case, what I've learned about Aliant today

    suggests that it stands above other popular products

    in terms of BMS for operational issues and cylindrical

    cells for failure issues. The claim for UL approval

    to the wrong spec is curious . . . I'll explore further.



    I've not yet discovered any US suppliers of Aliant

    batteries but I've run out of time to look more today.



 

   Bob . . .

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uuccio(at)gmail.com
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Posted: Sat May 11, 2013 1:19 pm Post subject: Lithium Ion Battery for OBAM aircraft project

It does not happen with A123 System cell as they meet the UL1342 testing. Published on www.Birdman.net.au website.



   I was unable to find any such testing protocol on

   the UL website at http://tinyurl.com/brpeblz



   Further, a stroking of the search engines failed

   to take notice of "UL1342" anywhere except on the

   birdman website. I'll write to them for clarification.

   Maybe this is a typo.



   I did find a listing for UL2575, the only one that

   speaks to lithium batteries (for power tools).





I believe that they mean UL1642.

 

http://ulstandardsinfonet.ul.com/scopes/scopes.asp?fn=1642.html 

 

 

  [quote][b]

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