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1james.baldwin(at)gmail.c
Guest

Posted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 11:56 am Post subject: Rocket-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 08/08/15

If you install the P model of the EMag you will have no problem with the ignition element of starting your IO540.Â  My O360 starts instantly once I installed the PMag.Â  Additionally, you'll get a self contained generator which will supply voltage to the ignition if the ship power fails.Â  I saw the 6 cylinder version of the PMag at Oshkosh and Brad said they are close to a ship date.Â  JBB

On Sun, Aug 9, 2015 at 12:03 AM, Rocket-List Digest Server <rocket-list(at)matronics.com (rocket-list(at)matronics.com)> wrote:

[quote]*

 

 Â =========================

 Â  Â Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive

 Â =========================

 

 Today's complete Rocket-List Digest can also be found in either of the

 two Web Links listed below.Â  The .html file includes the Digest formatted

 in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes

 and Message Navigation.Â  The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version

 of the Rocket-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor

 such as Notepad or with a web browser.

 

 HTML Version:

 

 Â  Â  http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter=2015-08-08&Archive=Rocket

 

 Text Version:

 

 Â  Â  http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter=2015-08-08&Archive=Rocket

 

 

 Â =======================

 Â  Â EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive

 Â =======================

 

 

 Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â ----------------------------------------------------------

 Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â Rocket-List Digest Archive

 Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  ---

 Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â Total Messages Posted Sat 08/08/15: 4

 Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  Â ----------------------------------------------------------

 

 

 Today's Message Index:

 ----------------------

 

 Â  Â  Â 1. 06:27 PM - Starting problemÂ  (Jim Stone)

 Â  Â  Â 2. 07:09 PM - Re: Starting problemÂ  (Scot Stambaugh)

 Â  Â  Â 3. 08:29 PM - Re: Starting problemÂ  (Vern Little)

 Â  Â  Â 4. 08:42 PM - Re: Starting problemÂ  (Jones15183(at)aol.com (Jones15183(at)aol.com))

 

 

 

 ________________________________Â  Message 1Â  _____________________________________

 

 

 Time: 06:27:58 PM PST US

 From: Jim Stone <jrstone54(at)att.net (jrstone54(at)att.net)>

 Subject: Starting problem

 

 

 I'm looking for ideas to improve my start up both cold and hot.

 I have an IO 540 C4 B5 with a non impulse mag on the upper plugs and Electro

 Air Electronic ignition (latest version on the lower plugs), and all aviatio

 n plugs.

 I removed the slick impulse Mag a year ago after the Slick Rep advised me to

 Â "get it off that engine before it comes apart and stops your engine".

 I have been starting with just the ElectroAir and realized it is not my star

 ting technique as much as it is a lack of spark.Â  ElectroAir told me that th

 e system has to measure a pretty fast cranking speed for what seems like a l

 ong time before it produces a spark.Â  This cranking pulls the battery voltag

 e down and if the voltage to the ElectroAir controller falls below 11 volts,

 Â it no longer produces a spark.Â  Of course I have no indication of no spark o

 ther than the obvious no start result.Â  So with some luck the batteries hold

 Â up long enough tilIÂ  I get the mixture right, if not, recharge and try late

 r.

 I'm considering the slick start but it requires a different mag from Slick a

 nd a coupler which all together cost 2k..Â  Seems like a big price to pay for

 Â better start performance, but I'm considering it.

 Does anyone have a proven solution?

 TIA,

 Jim Stone

 Louisville Kentucky

 HR 11

 

 

 ________________________________Â  Message 2Â  _____________________________________

 

 

 Time: 07:09:50 PM PST US

 From: Scot Stambaugh <f1rocket(at)yahoo.com (f1rocket(at)yahoo.com)>

 Subject: Re: Starting problem

 

 I have a dual Lightspeed system and have never had any problem.

 Electronic Ignition for Aircraft

 

 | =C2- |

 | =C2- |Â  | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- |

 | Electronic Ignition for AircraftSport Aviation, February 1995 In 1994 Kla

 usSavier entered five races, won them all and had no failures. ELECTRONIC I

 GNITION FOR AIRCRAFT By Klaus Savier E... |

 |Â  |

 | View on www.lightspeedengine... | Preview by Yahoo |

 |Â  |

 | =C2- |

 

 

 I also use the B&C Lightweight starter that doesn't seem to cause a signifi

 cant voltage drop in the system.

 

 B & C LIGHTWEIGHT STARTERS FOR LYCOMING from Aircraft Spruce

 

 | =C2- |

 | =C2- |Â  | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- |

 | B & C LIGHTWEIGHT STARTERS FOR LYCOMING from...Other Customers Have Also

 Viewed: CONT. 0-200 HEAT BOX CESSNA 150 STYLE HEAT BOX $173.95Â  |

 |Â  |

 | View on www.aircraftspruce.com | Preview by Yahoo |

 |Â  |

 | =C2- |

 

 

 Â And just to make the issue more challenging, my engine is a high-compressi

 on model with Lycon's 10.5:1 pistons.

 The only time it doesn't start by the 3 rotation is if I don't prime for a

 full 11 seconds, which is when the fuel pressure stabilizes.

 Hope this helps.

 Scot Stambaugh=C2-

 

 

 Â  Â  Â On Saturday, August 8, 2015 7:32 PM, Jim Stone <jrstone54(at)att.net (jrstone54(at)att.net)> wro

 te:

 

 

 

 I'm looking for ideas to improve my start up both cold and hot.

 I have an IO 540 C4 B5 with a non impulse mag on the upper plugs and Electr

 oAir Electronic ignition (latest version on the lower plugs), and all aviat

 ion plugs.

 I removed the slick impulse Mag a year ago after the Slick Rep advised me t

 o "get it off that engine before it comes apart and stops your engine".

 I have been starting with just the ElectroAir and realized it is not my sta

 rting technique as much as it is a lack of spark. =C2-ElectroAir told me

 that the system has to measure a pretty fast cranking speed for what seems

 like a long time before it produces a spark. =C2-This cranking pulls the

 battery voltage down and if the voltage to the ElectroAir controller falls

 below 11 volts, it no longer produces a spark. =C2-Of course I have no in

 dication of no spark other than the obvious no start result. =C2-So with

 some luck the batteries hold up long enough tilI =C2-I get the mixture ri

 ght, if not, recharge and try later.

 I'm considering the slick start but it requires a different mag from Slick

 and a coupler which all together cost 2k.. =C2-Seems like a big price to

 pay for better start performance, but I'm considering it.

 Does anyone have a proven solution?

 TIA,

 Jim Stone

 Louisville Kentucky=C2-

 HR 11

 

 

 ________________________________Â  Message 3Â  _____________________________________

 

 

 Time: 08:29:39 PM PST US

 From: Vern Little <voltar(at)vx-aviation.com (voltar(at)vx-aviation.com)>

 Subject: Re: Starting problem

 

 You could add a holdover battery, as illustrated on the IGN page of this doc

 ument: http://54.162.78.90/redmine/attachments/download/94/VFR%20Aircraft%20

 Electrical%20System%20Rev%205.pdf

 

 Vern

 HR-II C-GVRL

 

 =====

 Vernon R. Little | President, Vx Aviation

 

 > On Aug 8, 2015, at 6:27 PM, Jim Stone <jrstone54(at)att.net (jrstone54(at)att.net)> wrote:

 >

 >

 > I'm looking for ideas to improve my start up both cold and hot.

 > I have an IO 540 C4 B5 with a non impulse mag on the upper plugs and Elect

 roAir Electronic ignition (latest version on the lower plugs), and all aviat

 ion plugs.

 > I removed the slick impulse Mag a year ago after the Slick Rep advised me t

 o "get it off that engine before it comes apart and stops your engine".

 > I have been starting with just the ElectroAir and realized it is not my st

 arting technique as much as it is a lack of spark.Â  ElectroAir told me that t

 he system has to measure a pretty fast cranking speed for what seems like a l

 ong time before it produces a spark.Â  This cranking pulls the battery voltag

 e down and if the voltage to the ElectroAir controller falls below 11 volts,

 Â it no longer produces a spark.Â  Of course I have no indication of no spark o

 ther than the obvious no start result.Â  So with some luck the batteries hold

 Â up long enough tilIÂ  I get the mixture right, if not, recharge and try late

 r.

 > I'm considering the slick start but it requires a different mag from Slick

 Â and a coupler which all together cost 2k..Â  Seems like a big price to pay f

 or better start performance, but I'm considering it.

 > Does anyone have a proven solution?

 > TIA,

 > Jim Stone

 > Louisville Kentucky

 > HR 11

 >

 >

 >

 >

 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3

 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3

 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3

 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3

 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 >

 

 ________________________________Â  Message 4Â  _____________________________________

 

 

 Time: 08:42:38 PM PST US

 From: Jones15183(at)aol.com (Jones15183(at)aol.com)

 Subject: Re: Starting problem

 

 Hi Jim, former F! Rocker owner.Â  Can you explain your completeÂ  starting

 procedure.Â  I had Electroair and an Impulse mag.Â  I never hadÂ  a hot or cold

 start problem.Â  You talk about getting the mixtureÂ  right.Â  Shouldn"t be

 fooling with mixture control in process of eng.Â  starting.Â  Let me hear from you

 

 on you about yourÂ  complete startingÂ  process.Â  Billy Waters McGregor,tx.

 

 

 In a message dated 8/8/2015 10:29:54 P.M. Central Daylight Time,

 voltar(at)vx-aviation.com (voltar(at)vx-aviation.com) writes:

 

 You could add a holdover battery, as illustrated on the IGN page of this

 document:

 http://54.162.78.90/redmine/attachments/download/94/VFR%20Aircraft%20Electrical%20System%20Rev%205.pdf

 

 

 Vern

 HR-II C-GVRL

 

 ======

 

 Vernon R. Little | President, VxÂ  Aviation

 

 

 On Aug 8, 2015, at 6:27 PM, Jim Stone <_jrstone54(at)att.net_

 (mailto:jrstone54(at)att.net (jrstone54(at)att.net)) > wrote:

 

 

 I'm looking for ideas to improve my start up both cold andÂ  hot.

 I have an IO 540 C4 B5 with a non impulse mag on the upper plugs and

 ElectroAir Electronic ignition (latest version on the lower plugs), and all

 aviation plugs.

 I removed the slick impulse Mag a year ago after theÂ  Slick Rep advised me

 to "get it off that engine before it comes apart andÂ  stops your engine".

 I have been starting with just the ElectroAir andÂ  realized it is not my

 starting technique as much as it is a lack of spark.Â  ElectroAir told me that

 the system has to measure a pretty fastÂ  cranking speed for what seems like

 a long time before it produces a spark.Â  This cranking pulls the battery

 voltage down and if the voltage to theÂ  ElectroAir controller falls below 11

 volts, it no longer produces a spark.Â  Of course I have no indication of no

 spark other than the obvious noÂ  start result.Â  So with some luck the

 batteries hold up long enough tilIÂ  I get the mixture right, if not, recharge and

 

 try later.

 I'mÂ  considering the slick start but it requires a different mag from Slick

 and aÂ  coupler which all together cost 2k..Â  Seems like a big price to pay

 forÂ  better start performance, but I'm considering it.

 Does anyone have aÂ  proven solution?

 TIA,

 Jim Stone

 _Louisville Kentucky_ (x-apple-data-detectors://0/1)

 HRÂ  11

 

 

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 Â t-List"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-List

 

 

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 //forums.matronics.com

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 ot;">http://www.matronics.com/contribution

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 et-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-List

 ===========

  FORUMS -

 eferrer" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com

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 b Site -

 Â  Â  Â  Â  Â  -Matt Dralle, List Admin.

 rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution

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smokyray(at)rocketmail.co
Guest

Posted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 12:31 pm Post subject: Rocket-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 08/08/15

Hey JBB,

I wasn't aware that Brad at EMAG Air had broken the code for an IO540 PMag.( I had a PMag on my RVX post HR2, great product)

The IO540 has a different accessory case gear drive for the mag that requires all electronic ignition systems (so far) to use a crank sensor mounted on the prop flange. The normal PMag setup is an accessory case gear drive installation which until reading your email wasn't in existence.

If this is accurate it's great news indeed. 

V/R

Smokey

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 9, 2015, at 14:56, James Baldwin <1james.baldwin(at)gmail.com (1james.baldwin(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

[quote]If you install the P model of the EMag you will have no problem with the ignition element of starting your IO540.  My O360 starts instantly once I installed the PMag.  Additionally, you'll get a self contained generator which will supply voltage to the ignition if the ship power fails.  I saw the 6 cylinder version of the PMag at Oshkosh and Brad said they are close to a ship date.  JBB

On Sun, Aug 9, 2015 at 12:03 AM, Rocket-List Digest Server <rocket-list(at)matronics.com (rocket-list(at)matronics.com)> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  *

  =========================

    Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive

  =========================

 Today's complete Rocket-List Digest can also be found in either of the

 two Web Links listed below.  The .html file includes the Digest formatted

 in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes

 and Message Navigation.  The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version

 of the Rocket-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor

 such as Notepad or with a web browser.

 HTML Version:

     http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter=2015-08-08&Archive=Rocket

 Text Version:

     http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&Chapter=2015-08-08&Archive=Rocket

  =======================

    EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive

  =======================

            ----------------------------------------------------------

                            Rocket-List Digest Archive

                                       ---

                      Total Messages Posted Sat 08/08/15: 4

            ----------------------------------------------------------

 Today's Message Index:

 ----------------------

      1. 06:27 PM - Starting problem  (Jim Stone)

      2. 07:09 PM - Re: Starting problem  (Scot Stambaugh)

      3. 08:29 PM - Re: Starting problem  (Vern Little)

      4. 08:42 PM - Re: Starting problem  (Jones15183(at)aol.com (Jones15183(at)aol.com))

 ________________________________  Message 1  _____________________________________

 Time: 06:27:58 PM PST US

 From: Jim Stone <jrstone54(at)att.net (jrstone54(at)att.net)>

 Subject: Starting problem

 I'm looking for ideas to improve my start up both cold and hot.

 I have an IO 540 C4 B5 with a non impulse mag on the upper plugs and Electro

 Air Electronic ignition (latest version on the lower plugs), and all aviatio

 n plugs.

 I removed the slick impulse Mag a year ago after the Slick Rep advised me to

  "get it off that engine before it comes apart and stops your engine".

 I have been starting with just the ElectroAir and realized it is not my star

 ting technique as much as it is a lack of spark.  ElectroAir told me that th

 e system has to measure a pretty fast cranking speed for what seems like a l

 ong time before it produces a spark.  This cranking pulls the battery voltag

 e down and if the voltage to the ElectroAir controller falls below 11 volts,

  it no longer produces a spark.  Of course I have no indication of no spark o

 ther than the obvious no start result.  So with some luck the batteries hold

  up long enough tilI  I get the mixture right, if not, recharge and try late

 r.

 I'm considering the slick start but it requires a different mag from Slick a

 nd a coupler which all together cost 2k..  Seems like a big price to pay for

  better start performance, but I'm considering it.

 Does anyone have a proven solution?

 TIA,

 Jim Stone

 Louisville Kentucky

 HR 11

 ________________________________  Message 2  _____________________________________

 Time: 07:09:50 PM PST US

 From: Scot Stambaugh <f1rocket(at)yahoo.com (f1rocket(at)yahoo.com)>

 Subject: Re: Starting problem

 I have a dual Lightspeed system and have never had any problem.

 Electronic Ignition for Aircraft

 | =C2- |

 | =C2- |  | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- |

 | Electronic Ignition for AircraftSport Aviation, February 1995 In 1994 Kla

 usSavier entered five races, won them all and had no failures. ELECTRONIC I

 GNITION FOR AIRCRAFT By Klaus Savier E... |

 |  |

 | View on www.lightspeedengine... | Preview by Yahoo |

 |  |

 | =C2- |

 I also use the B&C Lightweight starter that doesn't seem to cause a signifi

 cant voltage drop in the system.

 B & C LIGHTWEIGHT STARTERS FOR LYCOMING from Aircraft Spruce

 | =C2- |

 | =C2- |  | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- |

 | B & C LIGHTWEIGHT STARTERS FOR LYCOMING from...Other Customers Have Also

 Viewed: CONT. 0-200 HEAT BOX CESSNA 150 STYLE HEAT BOX $173.95  |

 |  |

 | View on www.aircraftspruce.com | Preview by Yahoo |

 |  |

 | =C2- |

  And just to make the issue more challenging, my engine is a high-compressi

 on model with Lycon's 10.5:1 pistons.

 The only time it doesn't start by the 3 rotation is if I don't prime for a

 full 11 seconds, which is when the fuel pressure stabilizes.

 Hope this helps.

 Scot Stambaugh=C2-

      On Saturday, August 8, 2015 7:32 PM, Jim Stone <jrstone54(at)att.net (jrstone54(at)att.net)> wro

 te:

 I'm looking for ideas to improve my start up both cold and hot.

 I have an IO 540 C4 B5 with a non impulse mag on the upper plugs and Electr

 oAir Electronic ignition (latest version on the lower plugs), and all aviat

 ion plugs.

 I removed the slick impulse Mag a year ago after the Slick Rep advised me t

 o "get it off that engine before it comes apart and stops your engine".

 I have been starting with just the ElectroAir and realized it is not my sta

 rting technique as much as it is a lack of spark. =C2-ElectroAir told me

 that the system has to measure a pretty fast cranking speed for what seems

 like a long time before it produces a spark. =C2-This cranking pulls the

 battery voltage down and if the voltage to the ElectroAir controller falls

 below 11 volts, it no longer produces a spark. =C2-Of course I have no in

 dication of no spark other than the obvious no start result. =C2-So with

 some luck the batteries hold up long enough tilI =C2-I get the mixture ri

 ght, if not, recharge and try later.

 I'm considering the slick start but it requires a different mag from Slick

 and a coupler which all together cost 2k.. =C2-Seems like a big price to

 pay for better start performance, but I'm considering it.

 Does anyone have a proven solution?

 TIA,

 Jim Stone

 Louisville Kentucky=C2-

 HR 11

 ________________________________  Message 3  _____________________________________

 Time: 08:29:39 PM PST US

 From: Vern Little <voltar(at)vx-aviation.com (voltar(at)vx-aviation.com)>

 Subject: Re: Starting problem

 You could add a holdover battery, as illustrated on the IGN page of this doc

 ument: http://54.162.78.90/redmine/attachments/download/94/VFR%20Aircraft%20

 Electrical%20System%20Rev%205.pdf

 Vern

 HR-II C-GVRL

 =====

 Vernon R. Little | President, Vx Aviation

 > On Aug 8, 2015, at 6:27 PM, Jim Stone <jrstone54(at)att.net (jrstone54(at)att.net)> wrote:

 >

 >

 > I'm looking for ideas to improve my start up both cold and hot.

 > I have an IO 540 C4 B5 with a non impulse mag on the upper plugs and Elect

 roAir Electronic ignition (latest version on the lower plugs), and all aviat

 ion plugs.

 > I removed the slick impulse Mag a year ago after the Slick Rep advised me t

 o "get it off that engine before it comes apart and stops your engine".

 > I have been starting with just the ElectroAir and realized it is not my st

 arting technique as much as it is a lack of spark.  ElectroAir told me that t

 he system has to measure a pretty fast cranking speed for what seems like a l

 ong time before it produces a spark.  This cranking pulls the battery voltag

 e down and if the voltage to the ElectroAir controller falls below 11 volts,

  it no longer produces a spark.  Of course I have no indication of no spark o

 ther than the obvious no start result.  So with some luck the batteries hold

  up long enough tilI  I get the mixture right, if not, recharge and try late

 r.

 > I'm considering the slick start but it requires a different mag from Slick

  and a coupler which all together cost 2k..  Seems like a big price to pay f

 or better start performance, but I'm considering it.

 > Does anyone have a proven solution?

 > TIA,

 > Jim Stone

 > Louisville Kentucky

 > HR 11

 >

 >

 >

 >

 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3

 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3

 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3

 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3

 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 >

 ________________________________  Message 4  _____________________________________

 Time: 08:42:38 PM PST US

 From: Jones15183(at)aol.com (Jones15183(at)aol.com)

 Subject: Re: Starting problem

 Hi Jim, former F! Rocker owner.  Can you explain your complete  starting

 procedure.  I had Electroair and an Impulse mag.  I never had  a hot or cold

 start problem.  You talk about getting the mixture  right.  Shouldn"t be

 fooling with mixture control in process of eng.  starting.  Let me hear from you

 on you about your  complete starting  process.  Billy Waters McGregor,tx.

 In a message dated 8/8/2015 10:29:54 P.M. Central Daylight Time,

 voltar(at)vx-aviation.com (voltar(at)vx-aviation.com) writes:

 You could add a holdover battery, as illustrated on the IGN page of this

 document:

 http://54.162.78.90/redmine/attachments/download/94/VFR%20Aircraft%20Electrical%20System%20Rev%205.pdf

 Vern

 HR-II C-GVRL

 ======

 Vernon R. Little | President, Vx  Aviation

 On Aug 8, 2015, at 6:27 PM, Jim Stone <_jrstone54(at)att.net (jrstone54(at)att.net)_

 (mailto:jrstone54(at)att.net (jrstone54(at)att.net)) > wrote:

 I'm looking for ideas to improve my start up both cold and  hot.

 I have an IO 540 C4 B5 with a non impulse mag on the upper plugs and

 ElectroAir Electronic ignition (latest version on the lower plugs), and all

 aviation plugs.

 I removed the slick impulse Mag a year ago after the  Slick Rep advised me

 to "get it off that engine before it comes apart and  stops your engine".

 I have been starting with just the ElectroAir and  realized it is not my

 starting technique as much as it is a lack of spark.  ElectroAir told me that

 the system has to measure a pretty fast  cranking speed for what seems like

 a long time before it produces a spark.  This cranking pulls the battery

 voltage down and if the voltage to the  ElectroAir controller falls below 11

 volts, it no longer produces a spark.  Of course I have no indication of no

 spark other than the obvious no  start result.  So with some luck the

 batteries hold up long enough tilI  I get the mixture right, if not, recharge and

 try later.

 I'm  considering the slick start but it requires a different mag from Slick

 and a  coupler which all together cost 2k..  Seems like a big price to pay

 for  better start performance, but I'm considering it.

 Does anyone have a  proven solution?

 TIA,

 Jim Stone

 _Louisville Kentucky_ (x-apple-data-detectors://0/1)

 HR  11

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Lee Logan

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 86

Posted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 12:38 pm Post subject: Rocket-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 08/08/15

Rob: Â Yes to your inquiry, the problem is that they've been working on their 6-cylinder version for 6-7 years.Â  It has been promised for delivery many times in the past, but the "signs" are that this time it may actually happen.Â  Those showing an early interest were asked for down payments about two months ago.Â  You might want to get in line soon if you want one.



Lee...



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smokyray(at)rocketmail.co
Guest

Posted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 12:49 pm Post subject: Rocket-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 08/08/15

Thanks Lee, I sold my HR2 4 years ago.

 I do miss it sometimes but not like I miss the F16...

Cya!

Smokey 



Sent from my iPhone



On Aug 9, 2015, at 15:38, Lee Logan <leeloganster(at)gmail.com (leeloganster(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

[quote]Rob:  Yes to your inquiry, the problem is that they've been working on their 6-cylinder version for 6-7 years.  It has been promised for delivery many times in the past, but the "signs" are that this time it may actually happen.  Those showing an early interest were asked for down payments about two months ago.  You might want to get in line soon if you want one.



Lee...



   	  Quote: 	
		  

	


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voltar(at)vx-aviation.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Aug 09, 2015 1:04 pm Post subject: Rocket-List Digest: 4 Msgs - 08/08/15

.... So the solution is an unproven device that is not yet available? It sounds to me that this is a voltage droop problem which would also affect a P-MAG type ignition.  

In my opinion, the simplest way is to fix the voltage droop: new main battery, better wiring or by using an ignition holdover battery (aka essential bus).  The purpose of the new battery is to spin the starter at a high enough rpm with minimal voltage droop.  The purpose of the holdover battery is to prevent low voltage kickback and to provide temporary ignition power in the event of a main bus failure. 

======Vernon R. Little | President, Vx Aviation

On Aug 9, 2015, at 12:56 PM, James Baldwin <1james.baldwin(at)gmail.com (1james.baldwin(at)gmail.com)> wrote:

[quote]If you install the P model of the EMag you will have no problem with the ignition element of starting your IO540.  My O360 starts instantly once I installed the PMag.  Additionally, you'll get a self contained generator which will supply voltage to the ignition if the ship power fails.  I saw the 6 cylinder version of the PMag at Oshkosh and Brad said they are close to a ship date.  JBB

On Sun, Aug 9, 2015 at 12:03 AM, Rocket-List Digest Server <rocket-list(at)matronics.com (rocket-list(at)matronics.com)> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
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  =========================

    Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive

  =========================

 Today's complete Rocket-List Digest can also be found in either of the

 two Web Links listed below.  The .html file includes the Digest formatted

 in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes

 and Message Navigation.  The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version

 of the Rocket-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor

 such as Notepad or with a web browser.

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            ----------------------------------------------------------

                            Rocket-List Digest Archive

                                       ---

                      Total Messages Posted Sat 08/08/15: 4

            ----------------------------------------------------------

 Today's Message Index:

 ----------------------

      1. 06:27 PM - Starting problem  (Jim Stone)

      2. 07:09 PM - Re: Starting problem  (Scot Stambaugh)

      3. 08:29 PM - Re: Starting problem  (Vern Little)

      4. 08:42 PM - Re: Starting problem  (Jones15183(at)aol.com (Jones15183(at)aol.com))

 ________________________________  Message 1  _____________________________________

 Time: 06:27:58 PM PST US

 From: Jim Stone <jrstone54(at)att.net (jrstone54(at)att.net)>

 Subject: Starting problem

 I'm looking for ideas to improve my start up both cold and hot.

 I have an IO 540 C4 B5 with a non impulse mag on the upper plugs and Electro

 Air Electronic ignition (latest version on the lower plugs), and all aviatio

 n plugs.

 I removed the slick impulse Mag a year ago after the Slick Rep advised me to

  "get it off that engine before it comes apart and stops your engine".

 I have been starting with just the ElectroAir and realized it is not my star

 ting technique as much as it is a lack of spark.  ElectroAir told me that th

 e system has to measure a pretty fast cranking speed for what seems like a l

 ong time before it produces a spark.  This cranking pulls the battery voltag

 e down and if the voltage to the ElectroAir controller falls below 11 volts,

  it no longer produces a spark.  Of course I have no indication of no spark o

 ther than the obvious no start result.  So with some luck the batteries hold

  up long enough tilI  I get the mixture right, if not, recharge and try late

 r.

 I'm considering the slick start but it requires a different mag from Slick a

 nd a coupler which all together cost 2k..  Seems like a big price to pay for

  better start performance, but I'm considering it.

 Does anyone have a proven solution?

 TIA,

 Jim Stone

 Louisville Kentucky

 HR 11

 ________________________________  Message 2  _____________________________________

 Time: 07:09:50 PM PST US

 From: Scot Stambaugh <f1rocket(at)yahoo.com (f1rocket(at)yahoo.com)>

 Subject: Re: Starting problem

 I have a dual Lightspeed system and have never had any problem.

 Electronic Ignition for Aircraft

 | =C2- |

 | =C2- |  | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- |

 | Electronic Ignition for AircraftSport Aviation, February 1995 In 1994 Kla

 usSavier entered five races, won them all and had no failures. ELECTRONIC I

 GNITION FOR AIRCRAFT By Klaus Savier E... |

 |  |

 | View on www.lightspeedengine... | Preview by Yahoo |

 |  |

 | =C2- |

 I also use the B&C Lightweight starter that doesn't seem to cause a signifi

 cant voltage drop in the system.

 B & C LIGHTWEIGHT STARTERS FOR LYCOMING from Aircraft Spruce

 | =C2- |

 | =C2- |  | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- | =C2- |

 | B & C LIGHTWEIGHT STARTERS FOR LYCOMING from...Other Customers Have Also

 Viewed: CONT. 0-200 HEAT BOX CESSNA 150 STYLE HEAT BOX $173.95  |

 |  |

 | View on www.aircraftspruce.com | Preview by Yahoo |

 |  |

 | =C2- |

  And just to make the issue more challenging, my engine is a high-compressi

 on model with Lycon's 10.5:1 pistons.

 The only time it doesn't start by the 3 rotation is if I don't prime for a

 full 11 seconds, which is when the fuel pressure stabilizes.

 Hope this helps.

 Scot Stambaugh=C2-

      On Saturday, August 8, 2015 7:32 PM, Jim Stone <jrstone54(at)att.net (jrstone54(at)att.net)> wro

 te:

 I'm looking for ideas to improve my start up both cold and hot.

 I have an IO 540 C4 B5 with a non impulse mag on the upper plugs and Electr

 oAir Electronic ignition (latest version on the lower plugs), and all aviat

 ion plugs.

 I removed the slick impulse Mag a year ago after the Slick Rep advised me t

 o "get it off that engine before it comes apart and stops your engine".

 I have been starting with just the ElectroAir and realized it is not my sta

 rting technique as much as it is a lack of spark. =C2-ElectroAir told me

 that the system has to measure a pretty fast cranking speed for what seems

 like a long time before it produces a spark. =C2-This cranking pulls the

 battery voltage down and if the voltage to the ElectroAir controller falls

 below 11 volts, it no longer produces a spark. =C2-Of course I have no in

 dication of no spark other than the obvious no start result. =C2-So with

 some luck the batteries hold up long enough tilI =C2-I get the mixture ri

 ght, if not, recharge and try later.

 I'm considering the slick start but it requires a different mag from Slick

 and a coupler which all together cost 2k.. =C2-Seems like a big price to

 pay for better start performance, but I'm considering it.

 Does anyone have a proven solution?

 TIA,

 Jim Stone

 Louisville Kentucky=C2-

 HR 11

 ________________________________  Message 3  _____________________________________

 Time: 08:29:39 PM PST US

 From: Vern Little <voltar(at)vx-aviation.com (voltar(at)vx-aviation.com)>

 Subject: Re: Starting problem

 You could add a holdover battery, as illustrated on the IGN page of this doc

 ument: http://54.162.78.90/redmine/attachments/download/94/VFR%20Aircraft%20

 Electrical%20System%20Rev%205.pdf

 Vern

 HR-II C-GVRL

 =====

 Vernon R. Little | President, Vx Aviation

 > On Aug 8, 2015, at 6:27 PM, Jim Stone <jrstone54(at)att.net (jrstone54(at)att.net)> wrote:

 >

 >

 > I'm looking for ideas to improve my start up both cold and hot.

 > I have an IO 540 C4 B5 with a non impulse mag on the upper plugs and Elect

 roAir Electronic ignition (latest version on the lower plugs), and all aviat

 ion plugs.

 > I removed the slick impulse Mag a year ago after the Slick Rep advised me t

 o "get it off that engine before it comes apart and stops your engine".

 > I have been starting with just the ElectroAir and realized it is not my st

 arting technique as much as it is a lack of spark.  ElectroAir told me that t

 he system has to measure a pretty fast cranking speed for what seems like a l

 ong time before it produces a spark.  This cranking pulls the battery voltag

 e down and if the voltage to the ElectroAir controller falls below 11 volts,

  it no longer produces a spark.  Of course I have no indication of no spark o

 ther than the obvious no start result.  So with some luck the batteries hold

  up long enough tilI  I get the mixture right, if not, recharge and try late

 r.

 > I'm considering the slick start but it requires a different mag from Slick

  and a coupler which all together cost 2k..  Seems like a big price to pay f

 or better start performance, but I'm considering it.

 > Does anyone have a proven solution?

 > TIA,

 > Jim Stone

 > Louisville Kentucky

 > HR 11

 >

 >

 >

 >

 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3

 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3

 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3

 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3

 D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

 >

 ________________________________  Message 4  _____________________________________

 Time: 08:42:38 PM PST US

 From: Jones15183(at)aol.com (Jones15183(at)aol.com)

 Subject: Re: Starting problem

 Hi Jim, former F! Rocker owner.  Can you explain your complete  starting

 procedure.  I had Electroair and an Impulse mag.  I never had  a hot or cold

 start problem.  You talk about getting the mixture  right.  Shouldn"t be

 fooling with mixture control in process of eng.  starting.  Let me hear from you

 on you about your  complete starting  process.  Billy Waters McGregor,tx.

 In a message dated 8/8/2015 10:29:54 P.M. Central Daylight Time,

 voltar(at)vx-aviation.com (voltar(at)vx-aviation.com) writes:

 You could add a holdover battery, as illustrated on the IGN page of this

 document:

 http://54.162.78.90/redmine/attachments/download/94/VFR%20Aircraft%20Electrical%20System%20Rev%205.pdf

 Vern

 HR-II C-GVRL

 ======

 Vernon R. Little | President, Vx  Aviation

 On Aug 8, 2015, at 6:27 PM, Jim Stone <_jrstone54(at)att.net (jrstone54(at)att.net)_

 (mailto:jrstone54(at)att.net (jrstone54(at)att.net)) > wrote:

 I'm looking for ideas to improve my start up both cold and  hot.

 I have an IO 540 C4 B5 with a non impulse mag on the upper plugs and

 ElectroAir Electronic ignition (latest version on the lower plugs), and all

 aviation plugs.

 I removed the slick impulse Mag a year ago after the  Slick Rep advised me

 to "get it off that engine before it comes apart and  stops your engine".

 I have been starting with just the ElectroAir and  realized it is not my

 starting technique as much as it is a lack of spark.  ElectroAir told me that

 the system has to measure a pretty fast  cranking speed for what seems like

 a long time before it produces a spark.  This cranking pulls the battery

 voltage down and if the voltage to the  ElectroAir controller falls below 11

 volts, it no longer produces a spark.  Of course I have no indication of no

 spark other than the obvious no  start result.  So with some luck the

 batteries hold up long enough tilI  I get the mixture right, if not, recharge and

 try later.

 I'm  considering the slick start but it requires a different mag from Slick

 and a  coupler which all together cost 2k..  Seems like a big price to pay

 for  better start performance, but I'm considering it.

 Does anyone have a  proven solution?

 TIA,

 Jim Stone

 _Louisville Kentucky_ (x-apple-data-detectors://0/1)

 HR  11

 D============================================

  t-List"">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-List

 D========================

 ====================

 //forums.matronics.com

 D=============================================

 ot;">http://www.matronics.com/contribution

 D======================================

 3D======

 ===========

 et-List" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-List

 ===========

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 ===========

 b Site -

           -Matt Dralle, List Admin.

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 ===========

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