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Repairs

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JimmieBlackwell(at)austin
Guest

Posted: Mon Nov 20, 2006 8:01 pm Post subject: Repairs

I know this subject has been discussed before, but  would like to clarify it again with the help of some of you with more experience  and knowledge than me.  In the case of a second owner of an experimental  aircraft, is it legal for the second owner to make repairs which are outside the  scope of owner/operator repairs allowed for certified aircraft?

  

 It has always been my understanding that a second  owner of an experimental aircraft could do any repairs as long as the aircraft  is certified as airworthy by at least an A&P every year.  Does the  second owner need to have each repair signed off by an A&P or is it  sufficient to have an A&P just certify the aircraft as airworthy each  year?

  

 Jimmie

   [quote][b]

kirkhull(at)kc.rr.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Nov 20, 2006 8:15 pm Post subject: Repairs

The way I understood it was that you had to have an A&P or a repairmans cert to return it to service.  I am new to the experimental stuff with most of my experience is with airliners so I could be wrong.  

         

  

From: owner-kitfox-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jimmie Blackwell

 Sent: Monday, November 20, 2006 9:58 PM

 To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com

 Subject: Repairs  

  

     

I know this subject has been discussed before, but would like to clarify it again with the help of some of you with more experience and knowledge than me.  In the case of a second owner of an experimental aircraft, is it legal for the second owner to make repairs which are outside the scope of owner/operator repairs allowed for certified aircraft?  

    

   

    

It has always been my understanding that a second owner of an experimental aircraft could do any repairs as long as the aircraft is certified as airworthy by at least an A&P every year.  Does the second owner need to have each repair signed off by an A&P or is it sufficient to have an A&P just certify the aircraft as airworthy each year?  

    

   

    

Jimmie  

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crazyivan

Joined: 25 Aug 2006
Posts: 62
Location: Pensacola

Posted: Mon Nov 20, 2006 8:33 pm Post subject: Re: Repairs

Like all things, especially those that get into regulatory and your butt on the line, check with an expert.  



My amature reply is that you as the non-builder owner can do all of the maintenance but an A&P must do your annual.  I'm not sure if the A&P must be "annual" authorized, but I don't think so.  I just changed my prop (I'm not the builder) and the local FSDO knows all about it.

_________________
Dave
Piper PA-22/20

Last edited by crazyivan on Tue Nov 21, 2006 3:03 pm; edited 1 time in total

kirkhull(at)kc.rr.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 6:23 am Post subject: Repairs

This I am sure about.  Any A&P can do your annual .  they do not need an IA

to do It.  I have done some for friends and I only have an A&P.



--

Tom Jones

Joined: 12 Mar 2006
Posts: 752
Location: Ellensburg, WA

Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2006 7:16 am Post subject: Re: Repairs

In plain English:  Anyone can work on an experimental aircraft and the only signature ever needed is for the annual condition inspection.  This signature must be the builder with a Repairman's Certificate or someone with at least an A&P.



In gobuldy gook:

I am going to buy a used homebuilt, what work can I perform myself?



FAR Part 43 specifically states that the rules of that part do not apply to experimental, amateur-built aircraft. Therefore, any work (not just maintenance) on an experimental aircraft can be performed virtually by anyone regardless of credentials. (This does not apply to the condition inspection). Let common sense be your guide as to what maintenance you conduct yourself.



What is a Condition Inspection?

A condition inspection is the equivalent of an "annual" for a type certificated aircraft. Although FAR Part 91.409(c)(1) specifically states that experimental aircraft do not require annual inspections, the operating limitations on your homebuilt will include the following (or something similar):



No person shall operate this aircraft unless within the preceding 12 calendar months it has had a condition inspection performed in accordance with the scope and detail of appendix D to part 43, or other FAA-approved programs, and found to be in a condition for safe operation. This inspection will be recorded in the aircraft maintenance records. Condition inspections shall be recorded in the aircraft maintenance records showing the following or a similarly worded statement: "I certify that this aircraft has been inspected on (insert date) in accordance with the scope and detail of appendix D to part 43 and found to be in a condition for safe operation." The entry will include the aircraft total time in service, and the name, signature, certificate number, and type of certificate held by the

person performing the inspection.



See the condition inspection checklist for use in conducting annual condition inspections under the Operating section of this web.



Since I don't have a Repairman Certificate, who must perform the Condition Inspection?

The inspection can be performed by any licensed A&P mechanic, an FAA Approved Repair Station, or by the original builder of the airplane provided the builder has a "Repairman Certificate" for that aircraft from the FAA. Note that unlike an annual for a type certificated aircraft, the A&P mechanic does NOT have to have his/her "Inspection Authorization". Sometimes, if you are lucky, you can include as part of the purchase that the builder will continue to perform the condition inspections.

JimmieBlackwell(at)austin
Guest

Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 8:51 am Post subject: Repairs

Tom



Thank you for your comprehensive response.  That goes along with what I 

understand.



Have a great Thanksgiving.



Jimmie

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JimmieBlackwell(at)austin
Guest

Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 8:52 am Post subject: Repairs

Thanks Kirk.



Have a happy Thanksgiving.



Jimmie

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JimmieBlackwell(at)austin
Guest

Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 8:55 am Post subject: Repairs

Dave



I changed my prop as well and did all the paperwork through my local FSDO. 

It did not matter to the FSDO whether I had a repairman's certificate or 

not.



Appreciate your response and have a great Thanksgiving.



Jimmie

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Glenn Horne

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 96

Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 3:11 pm Post subject: Repairs

My though were that an A&P can do the annual but is took an IA to return the

aircraft back to service. An A&P could do a 100 hr inspection an return the 

aircraft back to service.

I may be wrong.

Glenn

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Fox5flyer
Guest

Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 3:44 pm Post subject: Repairs

Yes, Glenn.  With due respect, I'm about 99 percent sure you're wrong.

Anybody can do the work, but it only takes an A&P or the builder to sign off

the condition inspection and return it to service.  Sure, an AI can do it

too, but not required.  One of the wonderful things about the experimental

world...

I'm sure somebody around here can quote the chapter and verse.

Deke

---

Glenn Horne

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 96

Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 5:06 pm Post subject: Repairs

Yes. I was thinking of certified aircraft, not experimental.

Glenn

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