Matronics Email Lists :: View topic

Matronics Email Lists
Web Forum Interface to the Matronics Email Lists

Get Email Distribution Too! FAQ Search Memberlist Usergroups Register

Profile Log in to check your private messages Log in

External Tanks
Goto page 1, 2 Next

Matronics Email Lists Forum Index -> L29-List

View previous topic :: View next topic

Author Message

skyking76t(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 7:06 pm Post subject: External Tanks

Could someone out there maybe help with a problem? I am preparing to transfer my newly acquired L-29 from Minnesota to Virginia. I am trying to install the external fuel tanks but can't get the hardpoint hooks to close on the support rods. I was told all that was needed was to push the support rods into the latches. When this is done, the hook closes around the rod but doesn't lock. As soon as pressure is released, the hooks springs open. Seems to be in the jettison position all the time. 

 We've tried all the switch combinations on the armament panel and still open. Checked all the right panel switches in the F/C and R/C and schematics but still no cigar. Could someone tell me how to set the hooks into the closed position? Only other solution is to put a bolt thru the mechansim to hold the hook in the closed position. 

  

 Another issue. Can the Czech NO2 and O2 bottles be hydro tested in the US and be DOT approved if they pass? I've heard they had to be replaced if they are removed from the aircraft. Is this correct or can they be hydro tested?

  

 Any advise would be appreciated

  

 Thanks,

 Anthony  

 [quote][b]

ainut(at)knology.net
Guest

Posted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 8:12 pm Post subject: External Tanks

I wonder if a scuba dive shop would check those bottles?  They check 

scuba bottles, up to 5-7,000 psi routinely.



If you need a copilot for your MN to VA trip and can use a copilot with 

zero hours jet time, I might be available.  Depends on the time frame.



David

 	  Quote: 	
		   Could someone out there maybe help with a problem? I am preparing to 

 transfer my newly acquired L-29 from Minnesota to Virginia. I am 

 trying to install the external fuel tanks but can't get the hardpoint 

 hooks to close on the support rods. I was told all that was needed was 

 to push the support rods into the latches. When this is done, the hook 

 closes around the rod but doesn't lock. As soon as pressure is 

 released, the hooks springs open. Seems to be in the jettison position 

 all the time.

 We've tried all the switch combinations on the armament panel and 

 still open. Checked all the right panel switches in the F/C and R/C 

 and schematics but still no cigar. Could someone tell me how to set 

 the hooks into the closed position? Only other solution is to put a 

 bolt thru the mechansim to hold the hook in the closed position.

 Another issue. Can the Czech NO2 and O2 bottles be hydro tested in the 

 US and be DOT approved if they pass? I've heard they had to be 

 replaced if they are removed from the aircraft. Is this correct or can 

 they be hydro tested?

 Any advise would be appreciated

 Thanks,

 Anthony



 *

 *


	


-- 

If you're an American, just say NO to the Obamanation, to socialism, and get rid of Soros.

bculberson(at)staraviatio
Guest

Posted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 9:15 pm Post subject: External Tanks

A few quick thoughts. Is the power on when you try to lock the control rods? It could be de-activated that way with a wiring change to the armament panel or a short somewhere grounding the solenoid for the release. If it locks with power off and releases with power on, that could be it. Mine has no ARM panel, but the connector is there, I rigged a safety switch so I could drop in emergencies.

 

 O2 and Air bottles are the big elephant in the room no one wants to talk about. I tried all sorts of places, no ones willing to take liability for the inspection. My A&P "visually inspects" per the maintenance docs, but that's it. I've been thinking about replacing them with scuba and aircraft O2 tanks, haven't decided yet.

 

 Bill

 251 716 8119

 

 ---

SD737(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 9:29 pm Post subject: External Tanks

Aviation Classics in Reno, Nevada has a facility that will  hydro the bottles.

 775-972-5540  Ask for Lyn Jenkins. 

 They handle the L-39's and Migs.

  

  In a message dated 10/12/2010 12:15:24 A.M. Central Daylight Time,  bculberson(at)staraviation.com writes:

 [quote]   

A few quick thoughts. Is the power on when you try to lock the    control rods? It could be de-activated that way with a wiring change to the    armament panel or a short somewhere grounding the solenoid for the release. If    it locks with power off and releases with power on, that could be it. Mine has    no ARM panel, but the connector is there, I rigged a safety switch so I could    drop in emergencies.



O2 and Air bottles are the big elephant in the    room no one wants to talk about. I tried all sorts of places, no ones willing    to take liability for the inspection. My A&P "visually inspects" per the    maintenance docs, but that's it. I've been thinking about replacing them with    scuba and aircraft O2 tanks, haven't decided yet.



Bill

251 716    8119



---

skyking76t(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 1:01 pm Post subject: External Tanks

Hey David,

 Wish I could accomodate you but I am taking an instructor along and this will be my training for the type rating. I had an LOA in 2000 but didn't change it to a type rating. So I have to do the training over. But I'll keep you in mind for the future.

 Regards

 Tony



--- On Tue, 10/12/10, David <ainut(at)knology.net> wrote:



  	  Quote: 	
		  

From: David <ainut(at)knology.net>

Subject: Re: External Tanks

To: l29-list(at)matronics.com

Date: Tuesday, October 12, 2010, 12:12 AM



 --> L29-List message posted by: David <ainut(at)knology.net (ainut(at)knology.net)>



I wonder if a scuba dive shop would check those bottles?  They check scuba bottles, up to 5-7,000 psi routinely.



If you need a copilot for your MN to VA trip and can use a copilot with zero hours jet time, I might be available.  Depends on the time frame.



David

 	  Quote: 	
		   Could someone out there maybe help with a problem? I am preparing to transfer my newly acquired L-29 from Minnesota to Virginia. I am trying to install the external fuel tanks but can't get the hardpoint hooks to close on the support rods. I was told all that was needed was to push the support rods into the latches. When this is done, the hook closes around the rod but doesn't lock. As soon as pressure is released, the hooks springs open. Seems to be in  the jettison position all the time.

 We've tried all the switch combinations on the armament panel and still open. Checked all the right panel switches in the F/C and R/C and schematics but still no cigar. Could someone tell me how to set the hooks into the closed position? Only other solution is to put a bolt thru the mechansim to hold the hook in the closed position.

 Another issue. Can the Czech NO2 and O2 bottles be hydro tested in the US and be DOT approved if they pass? I've heard they had to be replaced if they are removed from the aircraft. Is this correct or can they be hydro tested?

 Any advise would be appreciated

 Thanks,

 Anthony

 

 *

 

 

 *


	


-- If you're an American, just say NO to the Obamanation, to socialism, and get rid ;       - The L29-List tp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?L29-List" target=_blank>http://www.matro                     &nbs;--> h=





	
 [quote][b]

skyking76t(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 1:22 pm Post subject: External Tanks

Bill, 

 We've tried with power on and power off. We can hear the hardpoints clicking, like they may be in the release mode but the hooks won't lock with the power on or off. Doug Weske of Air Investments said the power didn't need to be on...just shove the supports in. So we tried that..didn't work. 

 The owner took the armament panel out and just unplugged the cannon plug and removed the panel. We just plugged it back in and tried different switch positions. The ARM and Jettison switches have been tried as well as making sure the circuit breakers were on. I had a PhD in Electrical Engineering and a Mechanical Engineer working with me and we couldn't figure it out. So many interlocks. 

 Was hoping maybe someone else has had an issue like this and knew what to look at next.

  

 Yeah, Virginia has never had an L-29 in the state and I had to make sure the local FSDO would sign off the inspection program and Ops Limitations before I bought it. They made sure I was made aware the tanks need to be changed if they were out of the hydro limit and removed . The 29's approved inspection program has in it to maintain with the DOT regulations so I was hoping to get by with a hydro test and hopefully pass, just to get the aircraft back to VA. Then I would just change out to scuba tanks. 

  

 Thanks for the inut.

  

 Tony

  

 540 320 7597

  

  

  

  

 

--- On Tue, 10/12/10, Bill Culberson <bculberson(at)staraviation.com> wrote:



 [quote]

From: Bill Culberson <bculberson(at)staraviation.com>

Subject: Re: External Tanks

To: l29-list(at)matronics.com

Date: Tuesday, October 12, 2010, 1:13 AM



  A few quick thoughts. Is the power on when you try to lock the control rods? It could be de-activated that way with a wiring change to the armament panel or a short somewhere grounding the solenoid for the release. If it locks with power off and releases with power on, that could be it. Mine has no ARM panel, but the connector is there, I rigged a safety switch so I could drop in emergencies.



O2 and Air bottles are the big elephant in the room no one wants to talk about. I tried all sorts of places, no ones willing to take liability for the inspection. My A&P "visually inspects" per the maintenance docs, but that's it. I've been thinking about replacing them with scuba and aircraft O2 tanks, haven't decided yet.



Bill

251 716 8119



---

skyking76t(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 1:24 pm Post subject: External Tanks

Thanks for the info on the bottles!



--- On Tue, 10/12/10, SD737(at)aol.com <SD737(at)aol.com> wrote:

 [quote]

From: SD737(at)aol.com <SD737(at)aol.com>

Subject: Re: External Tanks

To: l29-list(at)matronics.com

Date: Tuesday, October 12, 2010, 1:25 AM



  Aviation Classics in Reno, Nevada has a facility that will hydro the bottles.

 775-972-5540  Ask for Lyn Jenkins. 

 They handle the L-39's and Migs.

  

  In a message dated 10/12/2010 12:15:24 A.M. Central Daylight Time, bculberson(at)staraviation.com writes:

 [quote] A few quick thoughts. Is the power on when you try to lock the control rods? It could be de-activated that way with a wiring change to the armament panel or a short somewhere grounding the solenoid for the release. If it locks with power off and releases with power on, that could be it. Mine has no ARM panel, but the connector is there, I rigged a safety switch so I could drop in emergencies.



O2 and Air bottles are the big elephant in the room no one wants to talk about. I tried all sorts of places, no ones willing to take liability for the inspection. My A&P "visually inspects" per the maintenance docs, but that's it. I've been thinking about replacing them with scuba and aircraft O2 tanks, haven't decided yet.



Bill

251 716 8119



---

transmatch(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:28 pm Post subject: External Tanks

Contact me thru my private e-mail or by phone about the hydrostatic testing. It can be done.

   Gene Freeman

   N229DD

   e-mail: transmatch(at)aol.com (transmatch(at)aol.com)

   cell: 702-545-7313

 

 

   

 

 

   --

delfin(at)mail.pf
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:53 pm Post subject: External Tanks

The hard point for the release of external fuel tanks have to be mechanically re-armed with a special L-29 tool.

 [b][i][b][i][b][i]Jean de Roubin

B. P. 8455

98 703 - FAA'A

PolynÃ©sie franÃ§aise

Tel : (+689)742620

Mail :[i] delfin(at)mail.pf (delfin(at)mail.pf)

[/i]

[/i][/b][/i][/b]

[/i][/b]





 

 

Le 12 oct. 2010 Ã  11:18, Anthony Royal a Ã©crit :

Bill, 

 We've tried with power on and power off. We can hear the hardpoints clicking, like they may be in the release mode but the hooks won't lock with the power on or off. Doug Weske of Air Investments said the power didn't need to be on...just shove the supports in. So we tried that..didn't work. 

 The owner took the armament panel out and just unplugged the cannon plug and removed the panel. We just plugged it back in and tried different switch positions. The ARM and Jettison switches have been tried as well as making sure the circuit breakers were on. I had a PhD in Electrical Engineering and a Mechanical Engineer working with me and we couldn't figure it out. So many interlocks. 

 Was hoping maybe someone else has had an issue like this and knew what to look at next.

  

 Yeah, Virginia has never had an L-29 in the state and I had to make sure the local FSDO would sign off the inspection program and Ops Limitations before I bought it. They made sure I was made aware the tanks need to be changed if they were out of the hydro limit and removed . The 29's approved inspection program has in it to maintain with the DOT regulations so I was hoping to get by with a hydro test and hopefully pass, just to get the aircraft back to VA. Then I would just change out to scuba tanks. 

  

 Thanks for the inut.

  

 Tony

  

 540 320 7597

  

  

  

  

 

--- On Tue, 10/12/10, Bill Culberson <bculberson(at)staraviation.com (bculberson(at)staraviation.com)> wrote:



 [quote]

From: Bill Culberson <bculberson(at)staraviation.com (bculberson(at)staraviation.com)>

Subject: Re: External Tanks

To: l29-list(at)matronics.com (l29-list(at)matronics.com)

Date: Tuesday, October 12, 2010, 1:13 AM



  A few quick thoughts. Is the power on when you try to lock the control rods? It could be de-activated that way with a wiring change to the armament panel or a short somewhere grounding the solenoid for the release. If it locks with power off and releases with power on, that could be it. Mine has no ARM panel, but the connector is there, I rigged a safety switch so I could drop in emergencies.



O2 and Air bottles are the big elephant in the room no one wants to talk about. I tried all sorts of places, no ones willing to take liability for the inspection. My A&P "visually inspects" per the maintenance docs, but that's it. I've been thinking about replacing them with scuba and aircraft O2 tanks, haven't decided yet.



Bill

251 716 8119



---

skyking76t(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 6:22 pm Post subject: External Tanks

Thank you! Would you know of anyone in the US that would have such a tool? I need to have the drop tanks for the extra fuel to fly the 29 to it's new home.

  

 Regards

 Anthony 

  

 

--- On Tue, 10/12/10, delfin(at)mail.pf <delfin(at)mail.pf> wrote:



  	  Quote: 	
		  

From: delfin(at)mail.pf <delfin(at)mail.pf>

Subject: Re: External Tanks

To: l29-list(at)matronics.com

Date: Tuesday, October 12, 2010, 6:51 PM



 The hard point for the release of external fuel tanks have to be mechanically re-armed with a special L-29 tool. 

       [b][i][b][i] [b][i]Jean de Roubin

 B. P. 8455

 98 703 - FAA'A

 Polynésie française

 Tel : (+689)742620

 Mail : [i] delfin(at)mail.pf (delfin(at)mail.pf)

[/i]

[/i][/b][/i][/b]

 



[/i][/b]

  Le 12 oct. 2010 à 11:18, Anthony Royal a écrit :

     Bill, 

 We've tried with power on and power off. We can hear the hardpoints clicking, like they may be in the release mode but the hooks won't lock with the power on or off. Doug Weske of Air Investments said the power didn't need to be on...just shove the supports in. So we tried that..didn't work. 

 The owner took the armament panel out and just unplugged the cannon plug and removed the panel. We just plugged it back in and tried different switch positions. The ARM and Jettison switches have been tried as well as making sure the circuit breakers were on. I had a PhD in Electrical Engineering and a Mechanical Engineer working with me and we couldn't figure it out. So many interlocks. 

 Was hoping maybe someone else has had an issue like this and knew what to look at next.

  

  

  

  

  

  

  

 

 

 	  Quote: 	
		  







	


	
 [quote][b]

czech6(at)mesanetworks.ne
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 7:31 pm Post subject: External Tanks

go to the hardware store, buy approx 1/4"  box  (square) steel pinch it together to form an oval. it will work.

 [quote]   ---

czech6(at)mesanetworks.ne
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 7:35 pm Post subject: External Tanks

If you hang one tank with the power on, it releases  automatically. Safety. You don't want to fly with one full tank hanging so it  releases both. Just leave the power off until both hooks are in  place.

 [quote]   ---

czech6(at)mesanetworks.ne
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 7:36 pm Post subject: External Tanks

who did you buy it from?

 [quote]   ---

bculberson(at)staraviatio
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 7:46 pm Post subject: External Tanks

That's right, your the man...

 

 ---

ncam(at)wave.co.nz
Guest

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 9:24 pm Post subject: External Tanks

If I was doing it again, I would replace the nitrogen and oxygen tanks with removable dive tanks, clipped in, and take them out and just get them refilled, lots of tyre shops use nitrogen, but I just used air in mine.Regards

Neville

On 13/10/2010, at 4:33 PM, Bill Geipel wrote:

[quote]who did you buy it from?

[quote]---

skyking76t(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2010 7:00 am Post subject: External Tanks

So, dry air can be used in place of the nitrogen? Great idea and cheaper too. Plenty of SCUBA shops around my area. I under stand they are 20 cu/ft tanks. Should be able to get aluminum tanks that are DOT approved and that solves the FAA problem.

 Thanks!

 Tony

 



--- On Wed, 10/13/10, Neville+/or Liz Cameron <ncam(at)wave.co.nz> wrote:



 [quote]

From: Neville+/or Liz Cameron <ncam(at)wave.co.nz>

Subject: Re: External Tanks

To: l29-list(at)matronics.com

Date: Wednesday, October 13, 2010, 1:16 AM



 If I was doing it again, I would replace the nitrogen and oxygen tanks with removable dive tanks, clipped in, and take them out and just get them refilled, lots of tyre shops use nitrogen, but I just used air in mine. Regards

 Neville

  On 13/10/2010, at 4:33 PM, Bill Geipel wrote:

 [quote]  who did you buy it from?

 [quote] ---

czech6(at)mesanetworks.ne
Guest

Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2010 7:53 am Post subject: External Tanks

Dry air is never dryer than Nitro. But it  works.

 [quote]   ---

skyking76t(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2010 10:31 am Post subject: External Tanks

Maybe better to stay with the nitrogen than dry air?



--- On Wed, 10/13/10, Bill Geipel <czech6(at)mesanetworks.net> wrote:

 [quote]

From: Bill Geipel <czech6(at)mesanetworks.net>

Subject: Re: External Tanks

To: l29-list(at)matronics.com

Date: Wednesday, October 13, 2010, 11:50 AM



    Dry air is never dryer than Nitro. But it works.

 [quote] ---

bculberson(at)staraviatio
Guest

Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2010 11:10 am Post subject: External Tanks

I have used scuba air for the last 3 years and they guy that had it

before me used scuba seven years before that. I have spent some time

working on mine recently making sure it will hold air as long as

possible. In doing so, I have removed a check a number of components and

have had no corrosion to speak of. As long as it's DRY, I think that is

the most significant issue. I'd be curious to know what other L-29 guys

are using....



 



BTW, I found a pretty cool ultrasonic leak detector from Grainger that

is pretty amazing. It surprised me how many really small leaks I had.

Detector was so sensitive and found so many leaks (and one bad reducer)

that she will hold 70 bar for months at a time now...



 



Bill



 



________________________________



From: owner-l29-list-server(at)matronics.com

[mailto:owner-l29-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Anthony Royal

Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 1:27 PM

To: l29-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: Re: External Tanks



 



Maybe better to stay with the nitrogen than dry air?



--- On Wed, 10/13/10, Bill Geipel <czech6(at)mesanetworks.net> wrote:

From: Bill Geipel <czech6(at)mesanetworks.net>

Subject: Re: External Tanks

To: l29-list(at)matronics.com

Date: Wednesday, October 13, 2010, 11:50 AM



Dry air is never dryer than Nitro. But it works.



	---

skyking76t(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2010 11:31 am Post subject: External Tanks

Bill, 

 Do you have the part number for the leak detector?

 Tony



--- On Wed, 10/13/10, Bill Culberson <bculberson(at)staraviation.com> wrote:



 [quote]

From: Bill Culberson <bculberson(at)staraviation.com>

Subject: RE: External Tanks

To: l29-list(at)matronics.com

Date: Wednesday, October 13, 2010, 3:09 PM



       

I have used scuba air for the last 3 years and they guy that had it before me used scuba seven years before that. I have spent some time working on mine recently making sure it will hold air as long as possible. In doing so, I have removed a check a number of components and have had no corrosion to speak of. As long as itâ€™s DRY, I think that is the most significant issue. Iâ€™d be curious to know what other L-29 guys are usingâ€¦.

 

 

 

BTW, I found a pretty cool ultrasonic leak detector from Grainger that is pretty amazing. It surprised me how many really small leaks I had. Detector was so sensitive and found so many leaks (and one bad reducer) that she will hold 70 bar for months at a time nowâ€¦

 

 

 

Bill

 

 

    

 

From: owner-l29-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-l29-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Anthony Royal

Sent: Wednesday, October 13, 2010 1:27 PM

To: l29-list(at)matronics.com

Subject: Re: External Tanks



 

 

     

Maybe better to stay with the nitrogen than dry air?



--- On Wed, 10/13/10, Bill Geipel <czech6(at)mesanetworks.net> wrote:

 



From: Bill Geipel <czech6(at)mesanetworks.net>

Subject: Re: External Tanks

To: l29-list(at)matronics.com

Date: Wednesday, October 13, 2010, 11:50 AM

   

Dry air is never dryer than Nitro. But it works.



 [quote]  

---

Display posts from previous:

	Matronics Email Lists Forum Index -> L29-List	All times are GMT - 8 Hours Goto page 1, 2 Next
Page 1 of 2

Jump to:

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum