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nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
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 Posted: Sat Dec 27, 2014 6:45 am Post subject: Marine deep cycle battery charging question |
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At 20:59 2014-12-26, you wrote:
| Quote: | Bob is sticking to this story..
From Earl, Retired fm GE, Sport Pilot now
|
Yes . . . until I read or see demonstrable
arguments to the contrary.
Battery sulfation is the result of standing
in a less than fully charged state for long periods of
time. The garden variety use of batteries in
cars and airplanes seldom discharges a battery
by more than a few percent . . . whereupon the
battery is recharged as soon as the engine
starts. The vehicle is stored with a topped-off
battery.
Then there is the question of just how effectively
one can break up big chunks of lead-sulfate
crystals with electrical stimulus from outside
the cell. Then, assuming the external stimulus
DOES reduce crystal size, just what kine of stimulus?
Researching the patents, DIY articles and the
marketing hype associated with a number of
de-sulfation chargers, I find no common thread
of technology or philosophy supported with
any manner of laboratory analysis as to whether
they even work as claimed.
It follows then than all you need for long
term storage support is to 'maintain' the open
circuit terminal voltage at some level just
above the voltage delivered by the chemistry
thus relieving chemistry from having to supply
tiny leakage currents, which in an RG battery
are a small fraction of those in wet batteries.
A 1950's wet battery would self-discharge in
90 to 120 days if not 'trickled' . . . the
RG battery will loose perhaps a few percent
per month and still crank your engine next
spring.
Self discharge is a function of battery temperature
and dissolved oxygen in the electrolyte. The sealed
battery's free oxygen is tiny compared to the wet
cell open to atmosphere. Further, storing the battery
in a cooler location will reduce the magnitude
of self-discharge leakage.
I'm discovering a similar conundrum in the study
of lithium batteries in airplanes. Question:
what is the value/necessity for a cell balancing
charger if we never give the charger a chance
to do what it does best . . . recharge and balance
a deeply discharged battery?
It's one thing to claim a benefit from some
device or process . . . quite another to
demonstrate that benefit in the operational
environment that is a light aircraft.
Bob . . .
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rig(at)q.com
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Dec 27, 2014 8:26 am Post subject: Marine deep cycle battery charging question |
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Thank you.
Dave
| Quote: | On Dec 27, 2014, at 7:44 AM, "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com> wrote:
At 20:59 2014-12-26, you wrote:
> Bob is sticking to this story..
>
> From Earl, Retired fm GE, Sport Pilot now
Yes . . . until I read or see demonstrable
arguments to the contrary.
Battery sulfation is the result of standing
in a less than fully charged state for long periods of
time. The garden variety use of batteries in
cars and airplanes seldom discharges a battery
by more than a few percent . . . whereupon the
battery is recharged as soon as the engine
starts. The vehicle is stored with a topped-off
battery.
Then there is the question of just how effectively
one can break up big chunks of lead-sulfate
crystals with electrical stimulus from outside
the cell. Then, assuming the external stimulus
DOES reduce crystal size, just what kine of stimulus?
Researching the patents, DIY articles and the
marketing hype associated with a number of
de-sulfation chargers, I find no common thread
of technology or philosophy supported with
any manner of laboratory analysis as to whether
they even work as claimed.
It follows then than all you need for long
term storage support is to 'maintain' the open
circuit terminal voltage at some level just
above the voltage delivered by the chemistry
thus relieving chemistry from having to supply
tiny leakage currents, which in an RG battery
are a small fraction of those in wet batteries.
A 1950's wet battery would self-discharge in
90 to 120 days if not 'trickled' . . . the
RG battery will loose perhaps a few percent
per month and still crank your engine next
spring.
Self discharge is a function of battery temperature
and dissolved oxygen in the electrolyte. The sealed
battery's free oxygen is tiny compared to the wet
cell open to atmosphere. Further, storing the battery
in a cooler location will reduce the magnitude
of self-discharge leakage.
I'm discovering a similar conundrum in the study
of lithium batteries in airplanes. Question:
what is the value/necessity for a cell balancing
charger if we never give the charger a chance
to do what it does best . . . recharge and balance
a deeply discharged battery?
It's one thing to claim a benefit from some
device or process . . . quite another to
demonstrate that benefit in the operational
environment that is a light aircraft.
Bob . . .
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nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelect
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Dec 27, 2014 9:31 am Post subject: Marine deep cycle battery charging question |
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|
At 08:38 2014-12-27, you wrote:
| Quote: | I have the Shumacher 1562 charger. Can I just hook them up in parallel?
|
You bet . . . for maintenance . . . hook batteries
up one at a time for charging. But once each battery
is in the 'maintenance' mode, then hook them all
in parallel to store them. Keep in mind that maintenance
current is measured in a terms of a couple milliamps
per battery.
The paralleling wire need not be made from welding cable,
22awg works fine.
Bob . . .
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rig(at)q.com
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Dec 27, 2014 10:17 am Post subject: Marine deep cycle battery charging question |
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Thanks. Perfect That's info I was looking for.
Dave
| Quote: | On Dec 27, 2014, at 10:30 AM, "Robert L. Nuckolls, III" <nuckolls.bob(at)aeroelectric.com> wrote:
At 08:38 2014-12-27, you wrote:
> I have the Shumacher 1562 charger. Can I just hook them up in parallel?
You bet . . . for maintenance . . . hook batteries
up one at a time for charging. But once each battery
is in the 'maintenance' mode, then hook them all
in parallel to store them. Keep in mind that maintenance
current is measured in a terms of a couple milliamps
per battery.
The paralleling wire need not be made from welding cable,
22awg works fine.
Bob . . .
|
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