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bbradburry(at)allvantage.
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 Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2006 5:12 am Post subject: One more Z-19 try! |
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My original question has generated absolutely no interest!! Lots of
discussion of measurement systems, are you grounded when only one foot
is on the floor, etc., but my silly little question has been ignored for
days even when it was embroiled in the screwup of the month! {:<(
Surely you guys don't want me to have to go and figure this out on my
own!! My blood would be on your hands!! {:<)
Here tis' again:
*Bob, and others,
I am installing a fuel injected Mazda rotary engine and trying to
follow the Z-19 guidelines for dual battery, single alternator.
Looking at the engine primary and secondary circuit, I need to
install a primary and secondary fuel pump, plus I want to power the
coils and the injectors off of the battery buss.
How should I do this? I suppose I could take the fuel pump diode
output and switch it to either of the two fuel pumps???
What about the coils and injectors? Should I set up similar circuits
for them, or is there a better way to reduce parts???
I would appreciate any guidance you guys could give me.
Thanks and Happy Thanksgiving!
Bill B
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nuckollsr(at)cox.net
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| Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2006 7:20 am Post subject: One more Z-19 try! |
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At 08:11 AM 11/25/2006 -0500, you wrote:
| Quote: |
<bbradburry(at)allvantage.com>
My original question has generated absolutely no interest!! Lots of
discussion of measurement systems, are you grounded when only one foot is
on the floor, etc., but my silly little question has been ignored for days
even when it was embroiled in the screwup of the month! {:<(
Surely you guys don't want me to have to go and figure this out on my
own!! My blood would be on your hands!! {:<)
Here tis' again:
|
Yes it has. I've been pondering the underlying
philosophy behind what I will offer later today.
Bob . . .
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klehman(at)albedo.net
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| Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2006 9:59 am Post subject: One more Z-19 try! |
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Unless one is familiar with rotary engines there is perhaps little that
can be said. Will the thing continue to run and make sufficient power to
stay airborne if either primary or secondary ignition or injectors fail?
No point have multiple power sources if it just multiplies the things
that can kill the engine. I'd suggest you look at what others have done
and then ask specific questions. Have you looked at the Real World
Solutions website?
Ken
Bill Bradburry wrote:
| Quote: |
<bbradburry(at)allvantage.com>
My original question has generated absolutely no interest!! Lots of
discussion of measurement systems, are you grounded when only one foot
is on the floor, etc., but my silly little question has been ignored
for days even when it was embroiled in the screwup of the month! {:<(
Surely you guys don't want me to have to go and figure this out on my
own!! My blood would be on your hands!! {:<)
Here tis' again:
*Bob, and others,
I am installing a fuel injected Mazda rotary engine and trying to
follow the Z-19 guidelines for dual battery, single alternator.
Looking at the engine primary and secondary circuit, I need to
install a primary and secondary fuel pump, plus I want to power the
coils and the injectors off of the battery buss.
How should I do this? I suppose I could take the fuel pump diode
output and switch it to either of the two fuel pumps???
What about the coils and injectors? Should I set up similar
circuits for them, or is there a better way to reduce parts???
I would appreciate any guidance you guys could give me.
Thanks and Happy Thanksgiving!
Bill B
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perfeng(at)3rivers.net
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| Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2006 11:16 am Post subject: One more Z-19 try! |
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Bill,
First, you never said how you intend to manage the engine (ie fuel, timing,
mixture, fuel pressure, and such). IMHO the eaisiest way to do so is to
utilize the EMC (engine management computer). In doing so many of your
queries will become mute.
The computer generally will manage all of these and as far as powering from
the battery bus, it doesn't care where the power comes from. Some systems
(such as Ford) utilize primary and secondary fuel pumps, it depends on the
operating parameters like timing advance curves, return fuel pressure, coil
dwell, and in general the design of the system. If primary and secondary
components are needed to maintain your system, the computer will be designed
to manage them. If you just want redundancy, one of the easiest ways is to
duplicaate that portion of the system with a seperate circuit.
Having ran a hot rod shop for many, many years, we have done conversions on
just about every kind of vehicle. As a general rule, we may modify the
parameters of the computer and streamline the sensors but, we hardly ever
try to re-invent the management system itself.
A place to start with Mazda powerplants is Adkins Rotary Specialties out of
Tacoma, Washington. There are several ohters that are really knowledgeable
but, we had excellent luck working with them on Mazda type situations.
As far as reprograming the computer, there are several outfits that can do
just that. One of the one's we use can actually design and build a totally
new EMC for the application if our requirements are that far outside of the
O.E.M. spec.s.(really exotic).
Just a suggestion...
Jim Duckett, RV-7A
---
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fvalarm(at)rapidnet.net
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| Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2006 11:36 am Post subject: One more Z-19 try! |
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Bill,
Your needs are similar to what us Subaru guys need to do. So while I'm not
there yet, may I suggest you look at Eggenfellner.com for their solutions.
The needs are very similar to a Rotary setup. They have many flying and
many more under construction. Theirs is based on the Expbus but I think it
may be changing. Z-19 based system is what I'm wanting to do but don't know
enough yet to advise you.
Bevan
RV7A
Eggenfellner H6 on order
--
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khorton01(at)rogers.com
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| Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2006 12:39 pm Post subject: One more Z-19 try! |
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One way to do multiple power sources for critical systems is to have
power from each bus going through a diode to the device of interest.
That way the critical system will continue to receive power even if
one of the power sources fails, but a fault on one bus cannot take
out the other bus, as the diodes provide protection. This approach
is used quite a bit in type-certificated aircraft with critical
systems. The critical systems should also be designed so that no
single failure of the system can prevent successful completion of the
flight. And, there should be a way to check for dormant failures on
some periodic basis (e.g. if you use diodes to provide multiple power
sources - you would want some way to confirm that both diodes were
functional).
Kevin Horton
On 25 Nov 2006, at 13:01, Ken wrote:
| Quote: |
Unless one is familiar with rotary engines there is perhaps little
that can be said. Will the thing continue to run and make
sufficient power to stay airborne if either primary or secondary
ignition or injectors fail? No point have multiple power sources if
it just multiplies the things that can kill the engine. I'd
suggest you look at what others have done and then ask specific
questions. Have you looked at the Real World Solutions website?
Ken
Bill Bradburry wrote:
>
> <bbradburry(at)allvantage.com>
>
> My original question has generated absolutely no interest!! Lots
> of discussion of measurement systems, are you grounded when only
> one foot is on the floor, etc., but my silly little question has
> been ignored for days even when it was embroiled in the screwup of
> the month! {:<(
>
> Surely you guys don't want me to have to go and figure this out on
> my own!! My blood would be on your hands!! {:<)
>
> Here tis' again:
>
> *Bob, and others,
> I am installing a fuel injected Mazda rotary engine and trying
> to follow the Z-19 guidelines for dual battery, single
> alternator. Looking at the engine primary and secondary
> circuit, I need to install a primary and secondary fuel pump,
> plus I want to power the coils and the injectors off of the
> battery buss.
> How should I do this? I suppose I could take the fuel pump
> diode output and switch it to either of the two fuel pumps???
> What about the coils and injectors? Should I set up similar
> circuits for them, or is there a better way to reduce parts???
> I would appreciate any guidance you guys could give me.
> Thanks and Happy Thanksgiving!
> Bill B
|
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greg(at)itmack.com
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Nov 25, 2006 2:20 pm Post subject: One more Z-19 try! |
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Bill, did you look at the drawing I posted on the Rotary list, is there
some problem that you see with my system?
Greg
[quote]
Bill,
Your needs are similar to what us Subaru guys need to do. So while I'm
not
there yet, may I suggest you look at Eggenfellner.com for their solutions.
The needs are very similar to a Rotary setup. They have many flying and
many more under construction. Theirs is based on the Expbus but I think
it
may be changing. Z-19 based system is what I'm wanting to do but don't
know
enough yet to advise you.
Bevan
RV7A
Eggenfellner H6 on order
--
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http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List |
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