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Sierra Electrical Problem

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bakerocb

Joined: 15 Jan 2006
Posts: 727
Location: FAIRFAX VA

Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 9:00 am Post subject: Sierra Electrical Problem

1/31/2007



Hello Bob Nuckolls and Fellow Listers, I am seeking your help for a friend 

who owns a Beech Sierra which has a 24 volt system. When we tried to start 

the airplane recently the starter intermittently engaged and quickly 

disengaged several times as soon as the master electrical switch was turned 

on. The keyed ignition / starter switch had not been touched.



The airplane was towed to an FBO who said that the starter contactor located 

near the battery back in the baggage compartment was faulty and a new one 

would cost $450. It has been ordered.



My requests:



1) Can anyone provide me with a copy of the electrical wiring diagram for 

this airplane?



2) Can anyone explain how electricity could get to the starter contactor 

without the normal contacts within the keyed ignition / starter switch being 

rotated into the "START" position?



Many thanks for your quick help.



OC -- The best investment we will ever make is in gathering knowledge.

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nuckollsr(at)cox.net
Guest

Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 12:05 pm Post subject: Sierra Electrical Problem

At 11:59 AM 1/31/2007 -0500, you wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  



1/31/2007



Hello Bob Nuckolls and Fellow Listers, I am seeking your help for a friend 

who owns a Beech Sierra which has a 24 volt system. When we tried to start 

the airplane recently the starter intermittently engaged and quickly 

disengaged several times as soon as the master electrical switch was 

turned on. The keyed ignition / starter switch had not been touched.



The airplane was towed to an FBO who said that the starter contactor 

located near the battery back in the baggage compartment was faulty and a 

new one would cost $450. It has been ordered.



My requests:



1) Can anyone provide me with a copy of the electrical wiring diagram for 

this airplane?



2) Can anyone explain how electricity could get to the starter contactor 

without the normal contacts within the keyed ignition / starter switch 

being rotated into the "START" position?



Many thanks for your quick help.



OC -- The best investment we will ever make is in gathering knowledge.


	


   This may be your lucky day. The ONLY TC aircraft wring diagrams

   book I possess is for the Sundowner/Sierra series aircraft. I've

   scanned the DC power, Ignition and Starter pages and posted

   at:



http://www.aeroelectric.com/Reference_Docs/BE23-24_Bat_Ign_Strtr.pdf



   I'd put a voltmeter on the hot coil terminal of K102 contactor

   and see if there's a stray voltage causing the contactor to

   close intermittently.



   I'd have to go check the data on that contactor but I think

   it's a cutler-hammer 6041H series device which you can probably

   find off the shelf for a lot less. Send me a photo of the part

   and I can tell you more.



   Bob . . .



        ----------------------------------------

        ( IF one aspires to be "world class",  )

        ( what ever you do must be exercised   )

        ( EVERY day . . .                      )

        (                  R. L. Nuckolls III  )

        ----------------------------------------

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Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

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bakerocb

Joined: 15 Jan 2006
Posts: 727
Location: FAIRFAX VA

Posted: Sat Feb 10, 2007 6:05 am Post subject: Sierra Electrical Problem

2/10/2007



Hello Bob Nuckolls, A tardy "thank you" for your great response to my 

request for help on this subject -- I wanted to wait until the FBO had 

finished fumbling around trying to solve the problem.



I won't bore you with the sad, gory FBO effort details, but they involve no 

apparent trouble shooting, eventually ordering three different relays, 

making a $450 twelve volt relay non returnable by mistakenly installing it 

and applying 24 volts to it, and so on.



You are correct in your assessment of relay type -- an Eaton (Cutler Hammer) 

6041H200 was finally installed.



Thanks to your circuit diagram the Sierra owner and I now understand how the 

circuit is supposed to work. It is still not clear to us how just replacing 

the starter relay could possibly solve the problem of intermittent cyclic 

starter activation when just the battery master switch is closed. It appears 

that the only source of electricity to close the starter relay must come 

from the ignition and start switch which was in the off position and not 

touched.



We won't get our hands on the airplane until Monday to examine the FBO 

efforts. Thanks again for your help.



OC -- The best investment we can make is to gather knowledge.



PS: One benefit to come from this is the owner deciding that purchasing the 

manuals to go with his airplane is a good thing to do.



----------------- FROM BOB NUCKOLLS ------------------



 	  Quote: 	
		     This may be your lucky day. The ONLY TC aircraft wring diagrams

   book I possess is for the Sundowner/Sierra series aircraft. I've

   scanned the DC power, Ignition and Starter pages and posted

   at:



 http://www.aeroelectric.com/Reference_Docs/BE23-24_Bat_Ign_Strtr.pdf



   I'd put a voltmeter on the hot coil terminal of K102 contactor

   and see if there's a stray voltage causing the contactor to

   close intermittently.



   I'd have to go check the data on that contactor but I think

   it's a cutler-hammer 6041H series device which you can probably

   find off the shelf for a lot less. Send me a photo of the part

   and I can tell you more.



   Bob . . .

- The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum -

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List

nuckollsr(at)cox.net
Guest

Posted: Sat Feb 10, 2007 8:32 am Post subject: Sierra Electrical Problem

At 09:00 AM 2/10/2007 -0500, you wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  



2/10/2007



Hello Bob Nuckolls, A tardy "thank you" for your great response to my 

request for help on this subject -- I wanted to wait until the FBO had 

finished fumbling around trying to solve the problem.



I won't bore you with the sad, gory FBO effort details, but they involve 

no apparent trouble shooting, eventually ordering three different relays, 

making a $450 twelve volt relay non returnable by mistakenly installing it 

and applying 24 volts to it, and so on.



You are correct in your assessment of relay type -- an Eaton (Cutler 

Hammer) 6041H200 was finally installed.



Thanks to your circuit diagram the Sierra owner and I now understand how 

the circuit is supposed to work. It is still not clear to us how just 

replacing the starter relay could possibly solve the problem of 

intermittent cyclic starter activation when just the battery master switch 

is closed. It appears that the only source of electricity to close the 

starter relay must come from the ignition and start switch which was in 

the off position and not touched.



We won't get our hands on the airplane until Monday to examine the FBO 

efforts. Thanks again for your help.


	


   I'm pleased that the story has a pleasant if not thrifty ending.

   If you could retrieve the old contactor, I'd REALLY like to do a

   tear-down inspection.



   Bob . . .

- The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum -

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?AeroElectric-List

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