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Bulb bypass

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pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 2:05 am Post subject: Bulb bypass

the bypass tees before and after the squeeze  bulb>>

  

 Hi all,

  

 do you have a history of bulbs fouling over  there?  Bypasses seems to be yet another complication and another flouting  of the KISS priciple.  I have never noticed anyone here with a bulb bypass  set up and I have never heard of there being a problem.

  

 Is this yet another example of the `it might  happen` attitude beloved by insurers without looking at the actual failure  rate?

  

 Cheers

  

 Pat

  

 do not archive

   [quote][b]

jindoguy(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 4:07 am Post subject: Bulb bypass

Pat, When the little valve broke I had just rotated and started to climb. I lost power and landed. Then the engine would start, but wouldn't keep running for very long. Fortunately, it was a Friday. Most of my neighbors were at work and not out flying, so my start and stop taxiing didn't inconvenience anyone. I eventually managed to get the Mk3 back to the hangar. I was at a total loss to explain what had happened, put the plane away and went off to California for classes. There, people with much more Rotax experience than me diagnosed the problem immediately. When I got back home I cut the primer bulb out of the fuel line and found it did not work, just as predicted . A field autopsy revealed that the valve had indeed failed. It no longer worked as a check valve, but worked quite nicely as a fuel shut off valve. The new fuel system has a bypass line. 



Rick



On 2/28/07, pat ladd <pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com (pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com)> wrote:[quote]        the bypass tees before and after the squeeze  bulb>>

  

 Hi all,

  

 do you have a history of bulbs fouling over  there?  Bypasses seems to be yet another complication and another flouting  of the KISS priciple.  I have never noticed anyone here with a bulb bypass  set up and I have never heard of there being a problem.

  

 Is this yet another example of the `it might  happen` attitude beloved by insurers without looking at the actual failure  rate?

  

 Cheers

  

 Pat

  

 do not archive

   [quote][b]  http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List http://forums.matronics.com 

when you live at the airport.  [quote][b]

olendorf

Joined: 06 Jul 2006
Posts: 140
Location: Schenectady, NY USA

Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 6:03 am Post subject: Re: Bulb bypass

I also had a primer bulb fail. I was preflighting when I noticed it.  I saw some tiny balls of something in the fuel line.  Further inspection revealed that the primer bulb internal parts had fallen apart.  Now I rebuild the fuel pump and replace primer bulb every 18 months.

_________________
Scott Olendorf
Original Firestar, Rotax 447, Powerfin prop
Schenectady, NY
http://sites.google.com/site/kolbfirestar/

Russ Kinne

Joined: 27 Jan 2006
Posts: 182

Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 7:05 am Post subject: Bulb bypass

PatFWIW I think adding a foot  of fuel line, weighing an  ounce or so is a most wise investment. From what I read you may not even  need a check-valve.

Bulbs DO fail -- mainly i think because they're (cheaply) made for boat or land uses where failure doesn't cause much fuss. An aviation primer-pump would be  lots better, but of course more $$ & more weight. Do you have aircraft salvage yards nearby? You can often buy a used anything for about half the new price. 

It 'twere me I'd put in a bypass fuel line & go fly. When/if the bulb  fails on the ground you'll probably feel it -- but if it fails in flight you won't drop out of the sky. We don't want that!

The "it might happen" attitude may be beloved by insurers -- but it may also save your plane and your life.

Good luck,

Russ 

do not archive

On Feb 28, 2007, at 5:04 AM, pat ladd wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  the bypass tees before and after the squeeze bulb>>

 

Hi all,

 

do you have a history of bulbs fouling over there?  Bypasses seems to be yet another complication and another flouting of the KISS priciple.  I have never noticed anyone here with a bulb bypass set up and I have never heard of there being a problem.

 

Is this yet another example of the `it might happen` attitude beloved by insurers without looking at the actual failure rate?

 

Cheers

 

Pat

 

do not archive

 	  Quote: 	
		           - The Kolb-List Email Forum - class="Apple-converted-space"> --> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List              - NEW MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -  class="Apple-converted-space">   --> http://forums.matronics.com

pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 9:45 am Post subject: Bulb bypass

The "it might happen" attitude may be beloved by  insurers -- but it  may also save your plane and your  life.>>

  

 Hi Russ,

 of course you are right, and reasonable forethought  and precautions are OK. However I would like to see some figures of bulb failure  per thousand flying hours before building in two more tee joints which I reckon  are more likely to fail than the bulb.

  

 I don`t know what its like in the US but here we  have a whole industry employing thousands and costing millions to keep people  safe from things that `might happen`. Its called Health and Safety and to give  just two examples.

  

 One. For years the net has been attached to the  goal posts at football fields by hooks so that the net can easily be removed. At  the last inspection of our village football field the twit of an inspector  ordered that the hooks be replaced by closed rings because `the goalkeeper might  get his finger caught in it` 

  

 Two.  On TV a couple of weeks ago the Health  and Safety Inspector was seen gathering all the members of a road repair  gang together before they started work to explain that road rollers and  excavators `sometimes go backwards` and that the men should be aware of the  dangers.

  

 Give me strength!

  

 Cheers

  

 Pat

 



   [quote][b]

pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 9:52 am Post subject: Bulb bypass

When I got back home I cut the primer bulb  out of the fuel line and found it did not work,>>

  

 Hi Richard,

  

 I am not suggesting that it CAN`T happen, just  querying how often and is it worth complicating the systemfor it..  The  bulb is rubber. Rubber deteriorates, fair enough. Just replace it when you do  your annual check. If we had belt and braces for everything that just might fail  we would never get off the ground.

  

 Cheers

  

 Pat

 



   [quote][b]

Thom Riddle

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1597
Location: Buffalo, NY, USA (9G0)

Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 5:32 am Post subject: Re: Bulb bypass

Pat,



It is called OSHA over here. Occupational Safety and Health Administration or somesuch nonsense. Are backup horns required on trucks and tractors in the UK? Every time a truck or tractor is put into reverse gear here, an incredibly loud and irritating claxon beeps until it is out of reverse gear. Of course, exposure to that requires ear protectors which muffle the sound so much you can't hear the guy on the ground trying to tell you something like, "You just ran over a deaf child, please stop so we can see if he is dead."



Over here, we call braces suspenders... just so you know .



Thom in Buffalo

do not archive

knowvne(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 6:31 am Post subject: Bulb bypass

Mark Vaughn



 --

pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 7:18 am Post subject: Bulb bypass

Are backup horns required on trucks and tractors in the UK?>>



Yes they are but there was this guy justifying his job by lecturing a crowd 

of roughnecks who had been repairing roads since before he was born.



Great Day in the Morning! How do these guys sleep at night knowing that 

their job could be dispensed with tomorrow and no one would be a bit worse 

off.



Cheers



Pat



do not archive

frank-margie(at)worldnet.
Guest

Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:49 pm Post subject: Bulb Bypass

Ref;

 From: "pat ladd" <[url=]pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com[/url]>

Subject:  Bulb bypass

the bypass tees before and after the squeeze  bulb>>

Hi all,

do you have a history of bulbs fouling over  there?  Bypasses seems to be 

yet another complication and another  flouting of the KISS priciple.  I 

have never noticed anyone here with a  bulb bypass set up and I have 

never heard of there being a  problem.

Is this yet another example of the `it might happen` attitude  beloved by 

insurers without looking at the actual failure rate?

 -------------------------------

 I've had a bulb fail-----check valve stuck closed  (fortunately on the ground).   I won't use one without a bypass  anymore.

 As a mattter of fact, I  recently installed a Facet electronic pump, in series, per recent  discussions on this forum. (Facet #40105, low pressure)  Only problem was a  leaking primer, now that it had pressure behind it---flooded the engine when I  was checking the new installation for leaks (Pump on, engine not running)   A new primer solved that. 

 Frank Clyma

 Orange Park, FL

   [quote][b]

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