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fix a small hole

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by0ung(at)brigham.net
Guest

Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 2:24 pm Post subject: fix a small hole

One other question: What is the best way to fix a small hole( the size of my

pinkie finger) in the horizontal stab?



Thanks,

Grant

 	  Quote: 	
		  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>


	


Well it kind of depends on what kind of fabric and paint.



If it is Polly fiber fabric and Polly tone paint it is easy...  2 ways



1:

Trim the ragged parts out of the hole



Lay unshrunk patch material over the hole and trace the outline of the patch

with a #2 pencil, make sure you have the required over lap  (1 inch for

holes smaller than 8 inches )  cut the patch with pinking shears.



Mask off the area outside the patch, leave an extra 1/2 inch or so of

working room larger than the patch.



Clean off all the coatings inside the masked area with mek. Everything will

wipe off readily, right down the bare fabric.



Cement the patch to the old fabric with poly-tak, let it dry.



With a 225 deg iron, heat smooth the cemented areas.



With a 350 deg iron, heat shrink the area of the patch over the hole. This

acts as a shrinking panel to retighten the fabric in the area of the repair.

Use a piece of cardboard as a shield to keep the iron off the cemented

areas.



Brush on a coat of poly brush and let it day.  



Spray poly spray to fill.



Paint with poly tone. You will find the poly tone is easy to spot spray into

the old paint with a good match unless the old paint is faded.



2:

Band aid option



It is perfectly safe and legal to just scuff sand the old poly tone and

cement directly on top of the old paint without cleaning off all the

coatings.  It just looks pretty rough when finished.  The poly tak will hold

just fine to the old poly tone.



Instructions from Poly fiber aircraft coatings book.

If you have other paint or fabric,,,,  call a distributor and follow their

directions.



Boyd

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 4:53 pm Post subject: Re: fix a small hole

Back in the old days I used to go through the process of doing it the Stitts or Polyfiber way.



After 1994, unless it is a large hole, bigger than an inch or two, and depending whether it is in a critical to flight area, I stick a "sticker" on the hole.  Most of the holes in the fabric of my 1992 mkIII are in the fuselage or tail section area.  Probably have 30 lbs of sticker on the old gal.



If I am out on a long flight, 1 or 2 inch black electrical tape works great.  So does duct tape.



I patched a 1/2" hole in the top of a wing, made with a screw driver, by making a dollar patch with clear packing tape and pinking shears.  Spray painted it with Aerothane.  No one knew it was there.  The clear packing tape accepted the top coat of two part Aerothane with no problem.



john h

mkIII

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

Wade Lawicki

Joined: 27 May 2007
Posts: 31
Location: Nashville Tn.

Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 6:07 pm Post subject: Re: fix a small hole

Grant,

          Go to the hobby shop or find a friend that has some mono-kote for covering model airplanes, get the color close and cut a circle an inch bigger than the hole.  start at the outside edges with a iron set at 225, seal the whole diameter then work your way inward. it sticks to the poly without burning it and will last a long time.



                                                    Fly Safe,

                                                                    Wade

d-m-hague(at)comcast.net
Guest

Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 6:37 pm Post subject: fix a small hole

At 09:07 PM 11/25/2007, Wade Lawicki wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		             Go to the hobby shop or find a friend that has some mono-kote 

 for covering model airplanes, get the color close and cut a circle an 

 inch bigger than the hole.  start at the outside edges with a iron set at 

 225, seal the whole diameter then work your way inward. it sticks to the 

 poly without burning it and will last a long time.


	


The problem with Monokote is that it's mylar film; if it starts to rip it 

keeps on ripping.  I haven't tried it as a Stits repair, but Coverite's 

prepainted 21st Century Fabric ( 

http://www.coverite.com/covering/covq0301.html ) or Super Coverite ( 

http://www.coverite.com/covering/covq1000.html ) iron on the same way but 

are dacron fabric.  Hmmm, maybe I should get some and try it.



I've used ripstop nylon for small repairs on my Ultrastar.  The roll I have 

came with the plane, but it looks like "spinnaker tape" sold at marine stores.



                                                 -Dana

--

  Ever notice how fast Windows runs? Neither did I.

Michael Sharp

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 118
Location: Oak Grove, MO (Kansas City)

Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 7:54 pm Post subject: fix a small hole

Why not use stits to patch it the same way??? 



Give Jim and Dondie a call..



PHONE: 1-877-877-3334

FAX: 1-614-877-3337

EMAIL: info(at)aircrafttechsupport.com 

Real nice folks!



Mike



Oak Grove Missouri

Mark III Classic (one of the last of Old Kolb) - 0hrs

Suzuki G13B 1.3L - 0hrs

Started with Big Lar still behind... 

Do not archive



--

_________________
The air up there in the clouds is very pure and fine...And why shouldn't it be?-
--It is the same the angels breathe.
Mark Twain,
Roughing it' 1886

Mike

jindoguy(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 6:53 am Post subject: fix a small hole

I pass this along without personally trying it, but the A & P who gave it to me recovered a T-craft last spring that won at this year's AirVenture.

When doing small patches, make a frame of appropriate size to the task at hand and staple a piece of cloth to it. Shrink per manufacturer's recommendations. Cut out patches, pink edges, and attach per manufacturer's recommendations. 



Rick

On Nov 25, 2007 9:53 PM, Kolbdriver <kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com (kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com)> wrote:

[quote] --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Kolbdriver" <kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com (kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com)>



Why not use stits to patch it the same way???



Give Jim and Dondie a call.. 



PHONE: 1-877-877-3334

FAX: 1-614-877-3337

EMAIL: info(at)aircrafttechsupport.com (info(at)aircrafttechsupport.com)

Real nice folks!



Mike



Oak Grove Missouri

Mark III Classic (one of the last of Old Kolb) - 0hrs 

Suzuki G13B 1.3L - 0hrs

Started with Big Lar still behind...

Do not archive



--

Richard Pike

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 1671
Location: Blountville, Tennessee

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 8:41 am Post subject: fix a small hole

Here's one more way: Take a piece of fabric, and dope it to a glass 

window or other flat glass plate with Poly-Brush. Let it dry and then 

pop it off, scrape the excess mess off the glass with a razor blade. 

Then cut out your patch, pink the edges, etc and dope it in place with 

Poly-Brush. Saves the trouble of making a frame, and still gives you a 

perfectly flat smooth patch. Plus you can still shrink it later to 

tighten it up if necessary. Also works with wide tapes if you should 

happen to need one of those instead.



Richard Pike

MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)



Richard Girard wrote:

[quote] I pass this along without personally trying it, but the A & P who gave 

 it to me recovered a T-craft last spring that won at this year's 

 AirVenture.

 When doing small patches, make a frame of appropriate size to the task 

 at hand and staple a piece of cloth to it. Shrink per manufacturer's 

 recommendations. Cut out patches, pink edges, and attach per 

 manufacturer's recommendations.



 Rick

 On Nov 25, 2007 9:53 PM, Kolbdriver <kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com 

 <mailto:kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com>> wrote:



     

     <kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com <mailto:kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com>>



     Why not use stits to patch it the same way???



     Give Jim and Dondie a call..



     PHONE: 1-877-877-3334

     FAX: 1-614-877-3337

     EMAIL: info(at)aircrafttechsupport.com

     <mailto:info(at)aircrafttechsupport.com>

     Real nice folks!



     Mike



     Oak Grove Missouri

     Mark III Classic (one of the last of Old Kolb) - 0hrs

     Suzuki G13B 1.3L - 0hrs

     Started with Big Lar still behind...

     Do not archive



     --

_________________
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0

Forgiving is tough, being forgiven is wonderful, and God's grace really is amazing.

jindoguy(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 2:35 pm Post subject: fix a small hole

Richard, As I said, the pre-shrinking idea came from my neighbor, but using unshrunk fabric means the patch will be understrength compared to the fabric to which it's attached, doesn't it?



Rick



 On Nov 26, 2007 10:24 AM, Richard Pike <richard(at)bcchapel.org (richard(at)bcchapel.org)> wrote:

[quote] --> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike <richard(at)bcchapel.org (richard(at)bcchapel.org)>



Here's one more way: Take a piece of fabric, and dope it to a glass

window or other flat glass plate with Poly-Brush. Let it dry and then 

pop it off, scrape the excess mess off the glass with a razor blade.

Then cut out your patch, pink the edges, etc and dope it in place with

Poly-Brush. Saves the trouble of making a frame, and still gives you a

 perfectly flat smooth patch. Plus you can still shrink it later to

tighten it up if necessary. Also works with wide tapes if you should

happen to need one of those instead.



Richard Pike

MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) 



Richard Girard wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   I pass this along without personally trying it, but the A & P who gave

 it to me recovered a T-craft last spring that won at this year's

 AirVenture. 

 When doing small patches, make a frame of appropriate size to the task

 at hand and staple a piece of cloth to it. Shrink per manufacturer's

 recommendations. Cut out patches, pink edges, and attach per 

 manufacturer's recommendations.



 Rick

 On Nov 25, 2007 9:53 PM, Kolbdriver <kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com (kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com)


	


 > <mailto:kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com (kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com)>> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  

     --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Kolbdriver"


	


 	  Quote: 	
		       < kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com (kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com) <mailto:kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com (kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com)>>



     Why not use stits to patch it the same way???



     Give Jim and Dondie a call.. 



     PHONE: 1-877-877-3334

     FAX: 1-614-877-3337

     EMAIL: info(at)aircrafttechsupport.com (info(at)aircrafttechsupport.com)


	


[quote]     <mailto: info(at)aircrafttechsupport.com (info(at)aircrafttechsupport.com)>

     Real nice folks!



     Mike



     Oak Grove Missouri

     Mark III Classic (one of the last of Old Kolb) - 0hrs 

     Suzuki G13B 1.3L - 0hrs

     Started with Big Lar still behind...

     Do not archive



     --

Richard Pike

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 1671
Location: Blountville, Tennessee

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 4:04 pm Post subject: fix a small hole

Not if you go back and shrink it after it is doped on, which is what you 

would normally do. If you preshrink it, and your fabric around the hole 

or the patch itself turns out to be a bit slack, then what do you do? 

Uh-oh. Attach your pre-doped patch, and then shrink it. So far, it's 

worked for me. (And actually, this is one of those things that's hard to 

get wrong, almost anything will turn out good, with just a little care 

and thought...)



Richard Pike

MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)

Richard Girard wrote:

[quote] Richard, As I said, the pre-shrinking idea came from my neighbor, but 

 using unshrunk fabric means the patch will be understrength compared 

 to the fabric to which it's attached, doesn't it?



 Rick



 On Nov 26, 2007 10:24 AM, Richard Pike <richard(at)bcchapel.org 

 <mailto:richard(at)bcchapel.org>> wrote:



     

     <richard(at)bcchapel.org <mailto:richard(at)bcchapel.org>>



     Here's one more way: Take a piece of fabric, and dope it to a glass

     window or other flat glass plate with Poly-Brush. Let it dry and then

     pop it off, scrape the excess mess off the glass with a razor blade.

     Then cut out your patch, pink the edges, etc and dope it in place with

     Poly-Brush. Saves the trouble of making a frame, and still gives you a

     perfectly flat smooth patch. Plus you can still shrink it later to

     tighten it up if necessary. Also works with wide tapes if you should

     happen to need one of those instead.



     Richard Pike

     MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)



     Richard Girard wrote:

     > I pass this along without personally trying it, but the A & P

     who gave

     > it to me recovered a T-craft last spring that won at this year's

     > AirVenture.

     > When doing small patches, make a frame of appropriate size to

     the task

     > at hand and staple a piece of cloth to it. Shrink per manufacturer's

     > recommendations. Cut out patches, pink edges, and attach per

     > manufacturer's recommendations.

     >

     > Rick

     >

     >

     > On Nov 25, 2007 9:53 PM, Kolbdriver <kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com

     <mailto:kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com>

     > <mailto:kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com <mailto:kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com>>>

     wrote:

     >

     >     

     >     < kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com <mailto:kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com>

     <mailto:kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com <mailto:kolbdriver(at)mlsharp.com>>>

     >

     >     Why not use stits to patch it the same way???

     >

     >     Give Jim and Dondie a call..

     >

     >     PHONE: 1-877-877-3334

     >     FAX: 1-614-877-3337

     >     EMAIL: info(at)aircrafttechsupport.com

     <mailto:info(at)aircrafttechsupport.com>

     >     <mailto: info(at)aircrafttechsupport.com

     <mailto:info(at)aircrafttechsupport.com>>

     >

     >

     >     Real nice folks!

     >

     >     Mike

     >

     >     Oak Grove Missouri

     >     Mark III Classic (one of the last of Old Kolb) - 0hrs

     >     Suzuki G13B 1.3L - 0hrs

     >     Started with Big Lar still behind...

     >     Do not archive

     >

     >     --

_________________
Richard Pike
Kolb MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Kingsport, TN 3TN0

Forgiving is tough, being forgiven is wonderful, and God's grace really is amazing.

slyck(at)frontiernet.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 6:55 am Post subject: fix a small hole

< Here's one more way: Take a piece of fabric, and dope it to a glass 

      window or other flat glass plate with Poly-Brush. Let it dry and then 

      pop it off, scrape the excess mess off the glass with a razor blade>



How about doing it on a teflon frying pan?  I never tried this method

but will keep it in mind.  The question about the strength of the patch..??

A little one inch hole won't make a significant change in the overall

strength of a large fabric panel.  In the case of fabric on a non stressed

area like the cage it would be totally irrelevant.

BB





 [quote][b]

NeilsenRM(at)comcast.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 7:33 am Post subject: fix a small hole

Just my personal observations but I don't do any of  this stuff and my fabric holds great. I have had to replace large portions of  the fabric on my cage where I welded on the new VW mount and other patches  around the cage where the fabric literally gets pounded by the prop and nothing  works loose.

  

 I merely wipe the area I will be sticking new  fabric to with MEK. Stick it with Poly Tack iron it tight and cover with the  Poly Fiber process. I don't even pinking shear anything. On my  ten year old airplane the only fabric that has worked loose is that  fabric that was pinked. 

  

 I know the certified process of covering fabric  airplane says all edges must be pinked but  is it better that way? I know if I were to lift a glued anything I start at a  corner. Try it yourself. Stick a piece of tape to something and then remove it.  Where is easiest to start. Do you start in the middle of a smooth side or  at a corner?

  

 Just getting a discussion going.

  

 Do not archive 

  

 Rick Neilsen

 Redrive VW powered MKIIIC



 [quote]   ---

jbhart(at)onlyinternet.ne
Guest

Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 8:24 am Post subject: fix a small hole

To: kolb <kolb-list(at)matronics.com>

............

< Here's one more way: Take a piece of fabric, and dope it to a glass 

      window or other flat glass plate with Poly-Brush. Let it dry and then 

      pop it off, scrape the excess mess off the glass with a razor blade>



How about doing it on a teflon frying pan?  I never tried this method

but will keep it in mind.  The question about the strength of the patch..??

A little one inch hole won't make a significant change in the overall

strength of a large fabric panel.  In the case of fabric on a non stressed

area like the cage it would be totally irrelevant.

...........



Bob and others,



Strength of the patch has to do with fabric overlap.  In most cases this is 

not a problem.  Strength is getting confused with tension of the patch and 

the surrounding fabric.  This is why Richard's method is good, in that, one 

can reestablish uniform fabric tension in the patch and the surrounding 

fabric by shrinking the patch.



A teflon coated cookie sheet might be an improvement over the frying pan.



Jack B. Hart FF004

Winchester, IN

Ralph B

Joined: 14 Apr 2007
Posts: 367
Location: Mound Minnesota

Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2007 10:13 am Post subject: Re: fix a small hole

 	  Quote: 	
		  "Richard Pike"]Here's one more way: Take a piece of fabric, and dope it to a glass 

window or other flat glass plate with Poly-Brush. Let it dry and then 

pop it off, scrape the excess mess off the glass with a razor blade. 

Then cut out your patch, pink the edges, etc and dope it in place with 

Poly-Brush. Saves the trouble of making a frame, and still gives you a 

perfectly flat smooth patch. Plus you can still shrink it later to 

tighten it up if necessary. Also works with wide tapes if you should 

happen to need one of those instead.



Richard Pike

MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) 	




Here's a similar way:



Clean up the hole with an exacto knife. I usually will make it square. Cut a piece of fabric with 1" overlap and round the corners. Use lacquer thinner to clean around the hole. Place the patch over the hole and brush Polybrush outward from the hole. Make it as smooth as possible. Let dry 24 hours. Take a small monokote iron at low heat to shrink it slightly. Using too much heat will make the sides of the patch bow inwards. Use two more more coats and then paint with Polytone. If done right, the patch will be difficult to see.



I have used Polybrush instead of Polytak for large patches too. It makes for a nicer patch.



Ralph B

_________________
Ralph B

Kolb Kolbra 912uls
N20386
550 hours

jb92563

Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 314
Location: Southern California

Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:57 pm Post subject: Re: fix a small hole

The good thing about the polyfiber/stits process is that if you use the right components they will all chemically bond to each other right from the poly tak to the poly-tone....thats why you can use the poly brush to stick patches down right to some MEK cleaned poly-tone and it will stick well.



I'd stay away from non-polyfiber products just to avoid having to do things twice when the non compatible product eventually lets go.

_________________
Ray

Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)
Moni MotorGlider
Schreder HP-11 Glider
Grob 109 Motorglider

Do Not Archive

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