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andrew(at)nzactive.com
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 Posted: Thu Jun 26, 2008 5:21 am Post subject: On vertical rolls... |
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...just a question on whether someone-who-knows can tell me the best technique for vertical rolls in a Rocket. Entry speed, exit speed, technique? I do have an aerobatic rating (required in NZ), and already do loops, rolls, & various combinations thereof, stall turns, as well a reasonable amount of spin training, botched manuever recovery, etc, so I feel happy enough to go out and give it a go (but would listen, if it seems dumb to try vertical rolls without an appropriate CFI - there's old pilots, and bold pilots.....) My problem with dual in my HRII is that I have a. no appropriate CFIs around here and b. no rudder pedals in the rear, so my aero instruction in the Rocket was with one of our Air Force's most senior instructors...a brave guy who just calmly sat there and coached me through all the manuevers, without access to rudders...but he's current off on deployment somewhere. So most of my dual aerobatics has been in a Citabria, which of course doesn't do vertical rolls very well. Anyway...
I haven't done vertical rolls yet. Any pointers?
Andrew, in NZ...
From: owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Im7shannon(at)aol.com
Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 6:46 PM
To: rocket-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Rocket-List: first10 hr report
450KS first 15 hour report is as follows:
1. Vertical rolls are the most fun so far.
2. Hey Smokey how many can you do?
Kevin
Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars.
[quote]
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
[b]
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fairlea(at)amtelecom.net
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| Posted: Thu Jun 26, 2008 5:50 am Post subject: On vertical rolls... |
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Andrew
I am not trying to take the fun out of flying but our rocket community had a loss of two people last weekend that we should all take note of. There are no official reports out yet but here is what is known from the news media and from pictures. The aircraft was seen to be doing aerobatics before the accident. The aircraft landed upside down with no sign of skid marks. This would lead one to believe it was in an inverted spin. What we need to do is to find out what type of situation would have caused this scenario. Be careful, these are fun fast airplanes that can do aerobatics, but when things go wrong they go wrong fast.
Tom Martin
From: owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of ACTIVE NZ - Andrew
Sent: June 26, 2008 9:21 AM
To: rocket-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: On vertical rolls...
...just a question on whether someone-who-knows can tell me the best technique for vertical rolls in a Rocket. Entry speed, exit speed, technique? I do have an aerobatic rating (required in NZ), and already do loops, rolls, & various combinations thereof, stall turns, as well a reasonable amount of spin training, botched manuever recovery, etc, so I feel happy enough to go out and give it a go (but would listen, if it seems dumb to try vertical rolls without an appropriate CFI - there's old pilots, and bold pilots.....) My problem with dual in my HRII is that I have a. no appropriate CFIs around here and b. no rudder pedals in the rear, so my aero instruction in the Rocket was with one of our Air Force's most senior instructors...a brave guy who just calmly sat there and coached me through all the manuevers, without access to rudders...but he's current off on deployment somewhere. So most of my dual aerobatics has been in a Citabria, which of course doesn't do vertical rolls very well. Anyway...
I haven't done vertical rolls yet. Any pointers?
Andrew, in NZ...
From: owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Im7shannon(at)aol.com
Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 6:46 PM
To: rocket-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: first10 hr report
450KS first 15 hour report is as follows:
1. Vertical rolls are the most fun so far.
2. Hey Smokey how many can you do?
Kevin
Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars.
| Quote: | | href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.comhref="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-Listhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution |
Checked by AVG.
Checked by AVG.
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kahuna
Joined: 02 Feb 2007
Posts: 93
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| Posted: Thu Jun 26, 2008 6:48 am Post subject: On vertical rolls... |
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Toms well stated comments not withstanding.
I recommend beginning your vert roll training slowly. They are very disorienting. Start with quarter rolls, then half and slowly work your way up to as many as you can get. Its the pressure on the elev that is the key and you will get that feel as you increase the amount of roll you carry. My early training techniques were quartrer stop, quarter stop, quarter stop on the way up. Think of it as 4 point rolls in the vertical. Then halfs and so forth. The key is an unloaded plane. If your carrying any G on the plane in the vertical, you will know it.
I can do 5 vert rolls in the S8 before I have to quit and hold it stopped before its time to fall off or do a hammer head. Takes a couple of seconds for my brain to stop spinning. I have to stop rolls and stop brain spinning before I get going back down hill again, else I get sick.
At least for the RV, torque rolls seem impossible for me past one-ish
Mike
[img]cid:1__=0ABBFEE7DFDC1C5F8f9e8a93df938(at)us.ibm.com[/img]"ACTIVE NZ - Andrew" ---06/26/2008 09:35:22 AM---...just a question on whether someone-who-knows can tell me the best technique for vertical rolls in a Rocket. Entry speed, exi
[img]cid:3__=0ABBFEE7DFDC1C5F8f9e8a93df938(at)us.ibm.com[/img]
To
[img]cid:3__=0ABBFEE7DFDC1C5F8f9e8a93df938(at)us.ibm.com[/img]
<rocket-list(at)matronics.com> [img]cid:3__=0ABBFEE7DFDC1C5F8f9e8a93df938(at)us.ibm.com[/img]
cc
[img]cid:3__=0ABBFEE7DFDC1C5F8f9e8a93df938(at)us.ibm.com[/img]
[img]cid:3__=0ABBFEE7DFDC1C5F8f9e8a93df938(at)us.ibm.com[/img]
Subject
[img]cid:3__=0ABBFEE7DFDC1C5F8f9e8a93df938(at)us.ibm.com[/img]
On vertical rolls... [img]cid:3__=0ABBFEE7DFDC1C5F8f9e8a93df938(at)us.ibm.com[/img][img]cid:3__=0ABBFEE7DFDC1C5F8f9e8a93df938(at)us.ibm.com[/img]
...just a question on whether someone-who-knows can tell me the best technique for vertical rolls in a Rocket. Entry speed, exit speed, technique? I do have an aerobatic rating (required in NZ), and already do loops, rolls, & various combinations thereof, stall turns, as well a reasonable amount of spin training, botched manuever recovery, etc, so I feel happy enough to go out and give it a go (but would listen, if it seems dumb to try vertical rolls without an appropriate CFI - there's old pilots, and bold pilots.....) My problem with dual in my HRII is that I have a. no appropriate CFIs around here and b. no rudder pedals in the rear, so my aero instruction in the Rocket was with one of our Air Force's most senior instructors...a brave guy who just calmly sat there and coached me through all the manuevers, without access to rudders...but he's current off on deployment somewhere. So most of my dual aerobatics has been in a Citabria, which of course doesn't do vertical rolls very well. Anyway...
I haven't done vertical rolls yet. Any pointers?
Andrew, in NZ...
From: owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of Im7shannon(at)aol.com
Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 6:46 PM
To: rocket-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: first10 hr report
450KS first 15 hour report is as follows:
1. Vertical rolls are the most fun so far.
2. Hey Smokey how many can you do?
Kevin
Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars.
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
=====================================
?Rocket-List">[b]http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-List
=====================================
u>http://forums.matronics.com[/u]
=====================================
ion">[b]http://www.matronics.com/contribution
=====================================
| | - The Matronics Rocket-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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smokyray(at)yahoo.com
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Jun 26, 2008 2:57 pm Post subject: On vertical rolls... |
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Patty Wagstaff once stated vertical rolls were her hardest item to perfect. I believe her, in the F16, pulling vertical at 5000' and 500 knots the upper limit of the airspace at 28K was the limit, not the number of rolls it would do! In the Rocket, it's maintaining a vertical line while rolling. They can be disorienting, but counting outloud usually helps and looking left and right to insure vertical...
Smokey
--- On Thu, 6/26/08, Michael W Stewart <mike.stewart(at)us.ibm.com> wrote:
| Quote: | From: Michael W Stewart <mike.stewart(at)us.ibm.com>
Subject: Re: On vertical rolls...
To: rocket-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Thursday, June 26, 2008, 9:38 AM
Toms well stated comments not withstanding.
I recommend beginning your vert roll training slowly. They are very disorienting. Start with quarter rolls, then half and slowly work your way up to as many as you can get. Its the pressure on the elev that is the key and you will get that feel as you increase the amount of roll you carry. My early training techniques were quartrer stop, quarter stop, quarter stop on the way up. Think of it as 4 point rolls in the vertical. Then halfs and so forth. The key is an unloaded plane. If your carrying any G on the plane in the vertical, you will know it.
I can do 5 vert rolls in the S8 before I have to quit and hold it stopped before its time to fall off or do a hammer head. Takes a couple of seconds for my brain to stop spinning. I have to stop rolls and stop brain spinning before I get going back down hill again, else I get sick.
At least for the RV, torque rolls seem impossible for me past one-ish
Mike
[img]cid:1.839850253(at)web50901.mail.re2.yahoo.com[/img]"ACTIVE NZ - Andrew" ---06/26/2008 09:35:22 AM---...just a question on whether someone-who-knows can tell me the best technique for vertical rolls in a Rocket. Entry speed, exi
[img]cid:2.839850254(at)web50901.mail.re2.yahoo.com[/img]
To
[img]cid:2.839850254(at)web50901.mail.re2.yahoo.com[/img]
<rocket-list(at)matronics.com> [img]cid:2.839850254(at)web50901.mail.re2.yahoo.com[/img]
cc
[img]cid:2.839850254(at)web50901.mail.re2.yahoo.com[/img]
[img]cid:2.839850254(at)web50901.mail.re2.yahoo.com[/img]
Subject
[img]cid:2.839850254(at)web50901.mail.re2.yahoo.com[/img]
On vertical rolls... [img]cid:2.839850254(at)web50901.mail.re2.yahoo.com[/img] [img]cid:2.839850254(at)web50901.mail.re2.yahoo.com[/img]
...just a question on whether someone-who-knows can tell me the best technique for vertical rolls in a Rocket. Entry speed, exit speed, technique? I do have an aerobatic rating (required in NZ), and already do loops, rolls, & various combinations thereof, stall turns, as well a reasonable amount of spin training, botched manuever recovery, etc, so I feel happy enough to go out and give it a go (but would listen, if it seems dumb to try vertical rolls without an appropriate CFI - there's old pilots, and bold pilots.....) My problem with dual in my HRII is that I have a. no appropriate CFIs around here and b. no rudder pedals in the rear, so my aero instruction in the Rocket was with one of our Air Force's most senior instructors...a brave guy who just calmly sat there and coached me through all the manuevers, without access to rudders...but he's current off on deployment somewhere. So most of my dual aerobatics has been in a Citabria, which of course doesn't do vertical rolls very well. Anyway...
I haven't done vertical rolls yet. Any pointers?
Andrew, in NZ...
From: owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rocket-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of Im7shannon(at)aol.com
Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 6:46 PM
To: rocket-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: first10 hr report
450KS first 15 hour report is as follows:
1. Vertical rolls are the most fun so far.
2. Hey Smokey how many can you do?
Kevin
Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars.
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
=====================================
?Rocket-List">[b]http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-List
=====================================
u>http://forums.matronics.com
=====================================
ion">[b]http://www.matronics.com/contribution
=====================================
[/b][/b]
|
| | - The Matronics Rocket-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Rocket-List |
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