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Wing locker questions

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z601(at)anemicaardvark.co
Guest

Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2009 8:18 am Post subject: Wing locker questions

I've searched the archives without luck, and also queried Zenith. Meanwhile, 

I'd like to ask the list my questions, to see if I get one answer that I 

consider better than the others. I found Zenith's drawings and the pictorial 

a bit lacking in detail, specifically:



1) Are the springs for the Dzus fasteners intended to be held in place with an 

A4 rivet?



2) If so, should the rivet be set flush, using a dimpling die or similar to 

provide a countersink on the Dzus plate?



3) The Dzus fasteners provided do not appear to be captive. That means they 

are likely to fall out when removed. Has anyone come up with a fix for this?

-- 



=============================================

                Jim B Belcher

    BS, MS Physics, Math, Computer Science

                  A&P/IA

     Retired aerospace technical manager

=============================================

psm(at)att.net
Guest

Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2009 8:48 am Post subject: Wing locker questions

Hi Jim,



It has been a couple of years since I dealt with these issues, so I 

hope my memory isn't too faulty.



I like to use "A" (soft aluminum) solid rivets for things like the 

Dzus springs and also for nutplates.  They are very easy to set and 

sufficiently strong to hold these devices in place.  Some times I set 

them with a small hammer and backplate.  Other times I use a small 

press I have mounted on one of my work benches.  Keep in mind the 

only load the rivets see in normal use is holding the part in place 

when it is not in use.



I use a standard countersink to set the factory head flush with the 

aluminium sheet on which the rivet is mounted.  It doesn't really 

matter if the countersink is exactly the right size.  If it is too 

small a little filing will remove the soft aluminum that is sticking 

out.  If it is a little too big then there might be a little movement 

in the attached part.



There are special capture springs for the Dzus parts.  I got some 

from Aircraft spruce.  They are little round spring steel wires that 

fit into the groove on the Dzus connector.



Have fun,



Paul

XL getting close

At 08:21 AM 2/12/2009, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  



I've searched the archives without luck, and also queried Zenith. Meanwhile,

I'd like to ask the list my questions, to see if I get one answer that I

consider better than the others. I found Zenith's drawings and the pictorial

a bit lacking in detail, specifically:



1) Are the springs for the Dzus fasteners intended to be held in 

place with an

A4 rivet?



2) If so, should the rivet be set flush, using a dimpling die or similar to

provide a countersink on the Dzus plate?



3) The Dzus fasteners provided do not appear to be captive. That means they

are likely to fall out when removed. Has anyone come up with a fix for this?

--

DaveG601XL

Joined: 27 Oct 2006
Posts: 351
Location: Cincinnati, Oh

Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2009 8:55 am Post subject: Re: Wing locker questions

Jim,



Yes, an A4 rivet will hold the Dzus springs in place.  The plans did not call out for flush riveting and I set them like normal.  I used a locking washer like those used on car trim fasteners.  I picked them up at Lowes in the hardware department.



Good luck,

_________________
David Gallagher
Cincinnati, OH area

rsteele(at)rjsit.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2009 9:04 am Post subject: Wing locker questions

I followed what was on the Wings DVD from Homebuilt Help.  Just as you

said, A4s, and not countersunk.  When fit together this doesn't seem to

present a problem.  You can get clips for the fasteners, but I've also

heard of using O rings.  I've done neither at this point.



Ron



------

craig(at)craigandjean.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2009 9:34 am Post subject: Wing locker questions

I believe some have used tight-fitting washers made from milk jugs to retain

the Dzus fasteners.



-- Craig



--

agbeyer(at)sbcglobal.net
Guest

Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2009 11:06 am Post subject: Wing locker questions

Ron had said that he has heard of using "O" rings on the fasteners to hold them in place.  I did use "O" rings on my HDS.  They have been in place for 4 years and work great.  If you use the Clips the holes have to be the right size so the clips will not slip through the hole.  I made the holes larger than standard so the fastener aligns easyer with the hole in the wing skin, and then slipped the "O" ring over the fastener.  

  

 AL from Oshkosh



 

   From: "rsteele(at)rjsit.com" <rsteele(at)rjsit.com>

To: zenith601-list(at)matronics.com

Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2009 11:04:36 AM

Subject: RE: Wing locker questions



--> Zenith601-List message posted by: <rsteele(at)rjsit.com (rsteele(at)rjsit.com)>



I followed what was on the Wings DVD from Homebuilt Help.  Just as you

said, A4s, and not countersunk.  When fit together this doesn't seem to

present a problem.  You can get clips for the fasteners, but I've also

heard of using O rings.  I've done neither at this point.



Ron



------

larry(at)macsmachine.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2009 1:25 pm Post subject: Wing locker questions

Hi Jim,

I made up some templates to get consistency and also dimplers to handle 

the rivets as well as Dzus guides.

The Dzus will hang up on the hole at the back relief for the retaining 

washers, so the radius hole is good to do

also. See link for tools and install results. Cowling page, but any 

installation is near the same for Dzus.

http://www.macsmachine.com/images/cowling/full/Dzustools.gif

http://www.macsmachine.com/images/cowling/full/Dzusdimples.gif

http://www.macsmachine.com/images/cowling/full/Dzusspring.gif

http://www.macsmachine.com/images/cowling/full/cowlnose2.gif

Hope this is useful,  A4 Rivets yes. Flush, yes.

You can order a fist full of plastic washers that will hold the Dzus 

fastener in place from

Aircraft Spruce as Half Grommets, GP type, usually GP5B, which are 

thermoplastic, $0.06 ea.

They work as well as the aluminum types and can also be removed with a 

small nose plier if necessary.



Larry McFarland 601HDS at www.macsmachine.com



Jim Belcher wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 I've searched the archives without luck, and also queried Zenith. Meanwhile, 

 I'd like to ask the list my questions, to see if I get one answer that I 

 consider better than the others. I found Zenith's drawings and the pictorial 

 a bit lacking in detail, specifically:



 1) Are the springs for the Dzus fasteners intended to be held in place with an 

 A4 rivet?



 2) If so, should the rivet be set flush, using a dimpling die or similar to 

 provide a countersink on the Dzus plate?



 3) The Dzus fasteners provided do not appear to be captive. That means they 

 are likely to fall out when removed. Has anyone come up with a fix for this?

Ron Lendon

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 685
Location: Clinton Twp., MI

Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2009 5:44 pm Post subject: Re: Wing locker questions

The tools LarryMac shows are the same ones I use.  I made my own washers from a milk bottle.  I use a punch set now that I acquired from HF.  Here is a link to where I used it for screws:

http://mykitlog.com/users/display_log.php?user=rlendon&project=113&category=0&log=32758&row=362



Also here is a detailed listing of the wing locker construction DZUS section in particular.  The washers, both top and bottom, hold the fastener in place and prevent marring the metal when turning the DZUS head.



http://mykitlog.com/users/display_log.php?user=rlendon&project=113&category=1683&log=30551&row=232

_________________
Ron Lendon
WW Corvair with Roy's Garage 5th bearing
CH 601 XLB
N601LT - Flying
http://www.mykitlog.com/rlendon
Corvair Engine Prints:
https://sites.google.com/site/corvairenginedata/

tonyplane(at)bellsouth.ne
Guest

Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2009 6:02 pm Post subject: Wing locker questions

I used "O" rings on the Duez fasteners to keep them attached.  I did buy 

some "holders", I believe they are plastic type washers, but have never 

installed them as the O rings have been holding for over 3 1/2 years.



Tony Graziano

XL/Jab3300; N493TG; 468 hrs

---

z601(at)anemicaardvark.co
Guest

Posted: Sat Feb 14, 2009 9:03 am Post subject: Wing locker questions

Thanks to everyone for their suggetions on installation of the wing locker. 

I've collected what I feel is a compromise between the best mix, the actual 

needs I have, airworthiness, etc etc. I might have done it without you guys 

and gals, but it would have taken a lot longer, and wouldn't have been nearly 

as good.



I still haven't received a response from Zenith. I'm somewhat disappointed in 

their lack of design detail.

-- 

==============================================

Those who can, do. Those who can't, sue.

=================================================

               Jim B. Belcher

    BS, MS Physics, math, Computer Science

                  A&P/IA

           Instrument Rated Pilot

     General Radio Telephone Certificate

=================================================



-- 

=============================================

                Do not archive.

=============================================

                Jim B Belcher

    BS, MS Physics, Math, Computer Science

                  A&P/IA

     Retired aerospace technical manager

=============================================

z601(at)anemicaardvark.co
Guest

Posted: Mon Feb 16, 2009 12:23 pm Post subject: Wing locker questions

A question for the list: has anyone (else) experienced a problem with the 

pre-drilled holes for nose rib#3 in the right nose skin? The angle to which 

rib 3 was pre-installed on the main spar, which seems to me to fix the 

location of rib 3, and hence, the hole locations in the nose skin.



The holes in my nose skin are 17mm to the left of where it appears they should 

be. It's easy to fix ... but I wonder if I've done something wrong, or if 

perhaps the tooling is wrong at Zenith. If the latter, they probably need to 

know.

=============================================

                Do not archive.

=============================================

                Jim B Belcher

    BS, MS Physics, Math, Computer Science

                  A&P/IA

     Retired aerospace technical manager

=============================================

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