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Strasnuts
Joined: 10 Feb 2009
Posts: 502
Location: Salt Lake City, UT
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 Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2010 5:13 am Post subject: Door Pins and Guides Q and A - taken from emails |
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I thought I would share some questions and answers on door pins and guides taken off emails with permission from Rudi. There are pros and cons for the different pins and guides offered. Builders that have dealt with the vans doors understand easier than new builders who haven't seen the mechanics behind Vans' doors.
Rudi,
I will be shipping your parts on Wednesday. One question. I now have two types of pins and guides to pick from actually three. I have bullet type SS pins that are hollow with a solid tip and I have bullet type pins that have a small magnet on the end. The hollow ones can have the Van's magnet dropped inside and glued. The bullet type pins go with aluminum or Delrin guides. The threaded portion on all my pins are a 5/16-24 set screw that you threadlock in after installing the magnet. If you want the bullet type that has the magnet on the end, it is already glued on. The other pins I have are on a slant and are hollow but have a solid tip, again making it possible to drop a magnet inside.
RUDI: What type works better with the standard Vans Sensors and standard Magnets? Bullet type with magnet on front or slanted with magnet on inside?
Sean: Both work good. The slanted pins require you use the Van's magnets that come in your kit. In a perfect world I would try to talk everyone into buying the 180 kit with slanted pins and Delrin guides. Van's had a good idea for the pushrods, they just didn't quite capture the whole plan. Slanted pins work really well because they pull the full 7/16 of the material. When you try a bullet type it will only pull half of the bullet or 7/32. Van's pushrods have the problem of being hollow tipped which catches their delrin guides or their original UHMW guides. I have seen builders' doors actually cut into their guides. One door that fell off was because the pilot thought the door was closed because the hollow tip was pressed into the plastic guide and later (in flight) failed and opened the door and there it went. My latch pulls the center of the door and really helps the pins into the guides. If your seal is super tight, your door will flex at the fwd and aft where the pins exit the door and enter the guides. The slanted pins are easier to line up because of the full 7/16 advantage.
They only work well with the Delrin guide blocks I make. Since you have the 180 kit I recommend the slanted pins and Delrin guides, up to you. With the slanted pins you have to "clock" the position to pull the door down and in like the vans original pushrod ends. This is done by filing the end of the pushrod until the pins line up to your preference. I know it is kind of weird to have so many options but I am getting a feel to see want everyone wants/likes.
RUDI: Why does the slanted pins only work with the Delrin guide block?
Sean: The shape of the slant makes it rub and catch on the aluminum as it pulls into the guides. I believe it is because the oval on the slant acts as a small rod and enlarges as it pulls into the guide. Metal on metal. That's why Van's pushrods won't work on aluminum guides. Aluminum gulls on aluminum.
RUDI: Why do you recommend the slanted pins with the 180 kit?
Sean: Partially answered above, but also because the pins extend so far and engage through the frame of the aircraft. With 90 degree kits and Van's original doors it is hard for some builders to get the pin extended past the Delrin. I like to see the pins through the cabin frame and aluminum structure instead of just the Delrin guide. That is why a lot of builders prefer the bullet type pins and aluminum guides on the 90 degree kits or original equipment.
Sean: Hope this helps. Let me know if you have any more questions. If you don't mind I may want to post this Q and A on Matronics or VAF. I like people to know pros and cons to each pin and guide.
Thanks
Sean Strasburg
www.planearound.com
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dlm46007(at)cox.net
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| Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2010 6:40 am Post subject: Door Pins and Guides Q and A - taken from emails |
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One other comment. The pins should be about 1/2 inch longer and cut to size
by the builder. Depending on where the latch mechanism is located within the
recess, Vans standard pins can be too short and not place the full
circumference within the metal door frame when engaged.
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scottmschmidt(at)yahoo.co
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| Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2010 1:43 pm Post subject: Door Pins and Guides Q and A - taken from emails |
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I switched my door pins and blocks to the slanted design using the delrin blocks and they work great. The slanted pin uses a threaded rod that can be removed so you can glue the stock magnets inside of them giving you a clean finish. As for clocking them, it was pretty simple. I would just make a mark and then use the 6" 3M wheel to file down the rod until it was perfect and loctite it.
I am using the stock Van's seal which requires more compression than some of the other aftermarket systems. I wanted as much early engagement of the pin as I could possibly get.
I'll get some pictures and more video tonight so you can see this system in action.
Scott Schmidtscottmschmidt(at)yahoo.com
From: DLM <dlm46007(at)cox.net>
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Mon, April 26, 2010 8:32:42 AM
Subject: RE: Door Pins and Guides Q and A - taken from emails
--> RV10-List message posted by: "DLM" <dlm46007(at)cox.net (dlm46007(at)cox.net)>
One other comment. The pins should be about 1/2 inch longer and cut to size
by the builder. Depending on where the latch mechanism is located within the
recess, Vans standard pins can be too short and not place the full
circumference within the metal door frame when engaged.
--
| | - The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List |
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