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tonyrenshaw268(at)gmail.c
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 Posted: Mon May 31, 2010 9:52 pm Post subject: Europa Making Unauthorised Transactions on my Visacard |
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Gidday,I'm hoping mad !!!!!!! 3 months ago I ordered a 912 S FWF kit, and about 3-4 weeks after I changed it to a 914 FWF kit. I recognised at the time this was inconveniencing and apologised, but was offered up a 6 year old unused 914 and a quick decision was req'd, and the FWF order needed to be changed. At the time I changed my mind the only significant component needing to be reordered was the engine mount, and the whole process was dragging along very slowly. Contradictory information was provided suggesting my kit was already packaged, and yet I knew the major components had not arrived at Europa, and in essence there was "at most" the two small shoeboxes of hardware that could have been prepackaged for me at that time. To put these back on the shelf is not a big task. Coincidentally, David Stanbridge posted on the Forum a statement that the company had intentions of "always having shelf stock", and on that basis when presented with a 180 Pound restocking fee I disputed it with Europa, Jon Pool. I have copied Davids message to the forum below for those that want a reminder. Significant time has passed whilst I wait for outstanding items, which have only just been dispatched, and still I have to wait for one. Also I have sent a raft of e-mails to both Fiona and to Jon Pool, however Fiona has not been reliable as a point of contact for reasons beyond her control, and yet other attempts at updating what has gone on with Karen did "not result" in any service. Within this period I changed e-mail addresses, but kept a vigil on my old one.
I wrote to Jon Pool offering to pay half of the amount, and received no reply, and today I come home from overseas to find my Visacard on file has been operated on for the full amount of the restocking fee. No courtesy e-mail.
I find the entire purchasing process has no transparency. I "never" knew what exactly I was getting with the 912S kit, and therefore was not able to ascertain the differences for my 914 FWF kit. The parts are not cost itemised, and I was also charged a packaging and delivery fee, with a quoted delivery of 80 Pounds, so therefore an additional 70 Pounds for the packaging. I don't believe this charge is written anywhere, nor are we charged other than the component cost for small orders, and shouldn't they be happy when you place a large one. These charges are just milking money out of the pockets of a small client base.
My experience has been in direct contrast to the transparent process implied by David Standbridge below.
To operate on a customers Visacard without their consent, when in obvious dispute is unacceptable. I have seen nothing to suggest what Europa wants of its business it has any intention of following through with. The level of communication is shocking. The transparency is non existent. I am happy to pay a fair price, when I know what it is, and only when I can take full control of my own money. I'm also happy to pay a premium for a good service. This has
not been the case, and I would like to demand an apology, and a refund until a proper agreed position is reached.
If anyone wants further information I am happy to provide an entire e-mail history of the conversations.
Reg
Tony Renshaw
Sydney Aussie.
| Quote: | Date:Mar 20, 2010Subject:Europa parts supply - 'Handling fee' warning | Quote: |
To all,
I would just like to take this opportunity to thank you for the support
for Europa. Just to keep you abreast of some of the changes:
1. By the end of this financial year (April 5th) we will be operating a
new stock control / parts system. As well as enabling us to auto order
stock (so that we never run low) and deliver faster, on a practical level
it will for instance enable us to provide photos of all of the items to
ensure that going forward we can provide the parts right first time.
2. The production facilities at Kirkbymoorside are close to completion in
terms of a revamp that will enable us to obtain EASA Production
Organisation Approval (POA) so that we can start manufacturing certified
aircraft. As they stand now you can almost eat your dinner off the floor
of both the machine and composite manufacturing shop.
3. The POA will be complemented by an EASA Design Organisation Approval so
that we can start "officially" designing certified aircraft. Obviously
this will also lead to better all round technical support for the Europa
aircraft.
Along the way there are bound to be some frustrations and we are not here
to bite the hand off anyone. We just want to ensure that Europa is a going
concern for many years to come and to offer support and further
enhancements for the existing and the future Europa fleet.
Thank you,
Dave Stanbridge |
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[quote][b]
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
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John Wighton
Joined: 18 May 2010
Posts: 242
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| Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2010 4:44 am Post subject: Re: Europa Making Unauthorised Transactions on my Visacard |
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Personally l have had good support from Mike and the guys at Europa. They are a bit slow and this is an area they could improve on. So far l have not parted company with any of my money. My Europa is up and flying and the few spares l have inquired about were not available off the shelf (spats and a new panel).
Having been well and truly bitten by other light aircraft companies l try nowadays to make some basic checks on the financial status of the companies l deal with. Having been in the aviation business (large and small) for 30+ years it is usually evident what a company's status is by looking at it's balance sheet and FY accounts. As for Swift TG who own Europa l would have expected to see significant reserves to enable them to take on Europa and invest sufficiently - typically a VLA aircraft certification will cost a minimum of 10-20 units, thats around €1M-€2M. There are many features on the Europa which will need to be changed to meet VLA (or even ELA1). See Liberty and how it changed (for the worse) from Ivan's original.
To this end please see attached Europa and Swift data (available to all from www.companieshouse.co.uk). You can make you own mind up what it means.
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
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Europa AViation 2006 AA.pdf |
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191.24 KB |
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Swift Technology Group AA 2009.pdf |
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74.43 KB |
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Europa Aviation 2009 AA.pdf |
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256 Time(s) |
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garrys(at)tampabay.rr.com
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| Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2010 5:49 am Post subject: Europa Making Unauthorised Transactions on my Visacard |
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To this end please see attached Europa and Swift data (available to all from
www.companieshouse.co.uk). You can make you own mind up what it means.
John, how about you simply summarizing "the data" for all of us.
Garry Stout
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
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John Wighton
Joined: 18 May 2010
Posts: 242
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| Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2010 6:12 am Post subject: Re: Europa Making Unauthorised Transactions on my Visacard |
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Well l am no accountant (l am therefore covering my backside from any legal flak...). I do have a high regard for people like David Stanbridge - he and l have lived parallel lives in many respects. However, what l have seen in the financial data does not suggest a multi-national company with cash reserves and a network of businesses.
The financials individually look weak (possibly acceptable for Europa Aircraft (2004) Ltd as it is getting back up on its feet) - there are ways and means of no revealing the true potential of Swift Group.
Maybe the best way to resolve this is to get Dave S to give us a summary, maybe with an indication of the investment levels being put towards the company?
The thing l struggle with is how Swift is (potentially) competing with itself with a Certified Europa and a new Swift VLA/23 cat aircraft as well.
| | - The Matronics Europa-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List |
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