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yakplt(at)yahoo.com
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 Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 2:47 pm Post subject: Solid State Ignition (MSD) |
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Gents (and one or two Ladies),
I had an idea some time back to develop and promote a quasi solid state ignition system for M-14 engines. With my background in car engines and my limited experience with M-14 engines, I saw an area where possibly the two technologies could come together.
Couple this with the current lack of mag coils for our engine… this idea led me to look into designing and operating a prototype, which in fact I did. I have decided not to pursue this idea because of lack of time and the fact that I do not have a very good business sense. I have handed this idea and detailed info on how to accomplish it to Dennis Savareese, who of course is the original gent who did all the research and design work on the high performance automobile ignition system that so many of us have used and value so highly.
I have decided to post this information here for all to use should they have a desire to, because sooner or later the gist of it will become public and for nothing else, I would indeed at least like to get the credit for thinking of it first.
One of the best automobile ignition systems for racing cars today is the MSD (Multiple Spark Discharge) ignition system. As it turns out, their MSD-6AL system will run off of 24 volts DC with no modifications. It has only ONE requirement for 12 volts, and that is the turn on signal that comes in the white wire and that is very low current. Figuring out how to do that is pretty easy, so I am not going into it here.
A standard high performance ignition coil from MSD can be used which is powered directly from the MSD-6AL unit.
The MSD box needs a trigger, which is easily provided by the existing points that are internal to the existing M-9 mag.
The hookup is pretty simple. Take your right mag out and remove the mag coil. You now have a spare mag coil. Route the high voltage output wire of the MSD automotive coil into the mag and connect it to the cigarette stub where the secondary of the original mag coil hooked to. It is possible to do this by going through the original P lead input connection on the M-9 mag. Bring the wire out from the mags internal points anyway you feel like it and hook it to the trigger input wire on the MSD-6AL system.
That’s pretty much it. You now have a solid state multiple spark discharge system operating on your right mag, which also happens to be your lower plugs. The lower plugs tend to foul more often than the upper plugs, and the MSD system will tend to burn these deposits right off immediately after starting.
The engine will still use the shower of sparks system on the left mag for starting, but should that fail, you can turn on just the right mag and start off the MSD system easily.
The MSD system runs off your aircrafts electrical system. Thus should your electrical system fail, you will lose ignition on your right side.
It would be possible to use this system on BOTH mags, and install a backup battery for emergencies, but I applied the KISS principle to this original design. Once you see all the options available, there is a ton of additional things that can be done with a little imagination.
I am not recommending that everyone go out and do this. It is an OPTION. Something to keep in the back of your mind. But it works. I’ve tried it.
Mark Bitterlich
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dstroud(at)xplornet.com
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| Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 3:51 pm Post subject: Solid State Ignition (MSD) |
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That's a very good start, Mark and I'm glad Dennis is running with it. Just a thought....why not get rid of
the points at the same time and substitute a suitable sized lobe sensing module for the trigger and go full electronic ?
David Stroud Ottawa, Canada
Christavia C-FDWS
Fairchild 51 replica
under construction C-FYXV
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mark.bitterlich(at)navy.m
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| Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 8:16 am Post subject: Solid State Ignition (MSD) |
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David, totally upgrading the whole system is the best way to go. Go
right ahead and do it. It only costs money.
That said, do not denigrate a mechanical contact (points) that handles a
low voltage at low RPM. The points in there now actually have primary
current flowing through them. They can arc, they can pit. When used
just to provide a trigger ground, they don't arc, they do not pit, but
they will indeed eventually wear out and have to be replaced. If anyone
wants to rip the guts out of the mag and put in a Hall Effect sensor,
they are welcome to do so.
I don't know if Dennis is going to run with it or not actually, but I
gave him the idea if he wants to mess with it.
Keep something in mind. Putting in a MSD-6AL firing a high performance
coil results in a HUGE spark. Putting in a modern trigger for the
control unit doesn't change that output one little bit. Leaving the
original mechanisms in there also allows mags that have advance systems
to keep working. It also means an average guy can go out and buy this
thing and put it in himself in less than a day.
This is a fully functioning electronic ignition system for a few hundred
dollars. Of course there are lots of ways to make it even more modern,
and to bring it totally into the 21st century! Just keep pumping in
$$$$ and you can make it do anything you want, anyway you want.
That's why I posted the basic concept.
Mark
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jan.mevis(at)informavia.b
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| Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 10:35 pm Post subject: Solid State Ignition (MSD) |
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It's all very correct what you write, Mark. I'm still working on a system too.
One important thing to mention, obvious to you and me, but easily overlooked: do not use an advanced electronic system with the original Russian wiring harness. The much higher energy (and voltage) will definitely cause problems. You have to change to the racing ignition cables, and better spark plugs (Champion REL37B, or the much cheaper automotive plugs).As a matter of fact, I think that the installation of Dennis' wiring kit already does 70 % of what you can get out of it. Without it, it's useless thinking of advanced electronic stuff.
Only my 2 cents,
Jan
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mark.bitterlich(at)navy.m
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| Posted: Fri Jul 09, 2010 7:51 am Post subject: Solid State Ignition (MSD) |
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You are absolutely correct Jan.
Mark
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