Matronics Email Lists Forum Index Matronics Email Lists
Web Forum Interface to the Matronics Email Lists
 
 Get Email Distribution Too!Get Email Distribution Too!    FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Control surface balancing

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Matronics Email Lists Forum Index -> RV10-List
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Lew Gallagher



Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Posts: 402
Location: Greenville , SC

PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2011 5:49 pm    Post subject: Control surface balancing Reply with quote

Hey guys,

This comes under the category of things I still need to learn. I was listening to a discussion at the hangar the other day about what a huge "no-no" it was when a certified plane got sent off for a paint job and came back with paint on the connections of the control surfaces. The conclusion was that the control surfaces had not been removed after painting to be rebalanced ... big stink with FAA involvement.

I think I vaguely remember someone mentioning here about balancing control surfaces, but I've never run across any instructions in the RV-10 build process about what the specs might be and how to balance. Not knowing anything different, I just painted everything in pieces on Wes's plane before final assembly, put it together, and no problems, he says it flies beautifully.

Now I'm concerned. Any info out there?

Thanks, - Lew


- The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum -
 

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List

_________________
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
Fly off completed !
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
carl.froehlich(at)verizon
Guest





PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2011 6:20 pm    Post subject: Control surface balancing Reply with quote

I had the same issue. Building my 8A I carefully trimmed the elevator
weights to get exact balance, then found I needed to add some additional
lead after paint to rebalance the elevators (the vast majority of the paint
is aft of the hinge line). Building the 10 I noted the elevators are way
trailing edge heavy using the weights in the kit. I sent a note to Van's
about this and the reply was along the line of 'that is correct, that is how
it is supposed to be'.

Bottom line, the elevators are nowhere near balance, paint or no paint.

Carl

--


- The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum -
 

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
Back to top
toaster73(at)embarqmail.c
Guest





PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2011 6:40 pm    Post subject: Control surface balancing Reply with quote

Quote:
From VANS, Scott R:

Chris, Balance limits are a 'maximum' so if your measurements fall anywhere
between zero and the limit, you're good. We've done extensive GVT (ground
vibration testing) and flight testing on the RV-10. The intent is to be
able to trim the weights according to the plans (if called out), bolt them
in and be well within the limits. We put the balance limits in the flight
test section because some builders alter the control surfaces during
construction...additional or different trim mechanisms, skin thicknesses
etc.

If your control surfaces are built according to the plans and your paint job
is not 'extreme', you should easily fall within the limits.

If you chose to check the balance, (excluding the rudder) you can just
disconnect the specific control surface from any control linkage (weight
elevators separately), get it in the level flight attitude and put a scale
under the trailing edge. The rudder would have to be removed, of course to
do this.

scott at van's

-Chris
#40072 (out of paint)

--


- The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum -
 

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
Back to top
indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com
Guest





PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2011 9:33 pm    Post subject: Control surface balancing Reply with quote

Excellent, thank you for sharing the information!

[quote] From: toaster73(at)embarqmail.com
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: Control surface balancing
Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2011 22:37:28 -0400

--> RV10-List message posted by: "Chris" <toaster73(at)embarqmail.com>

>From VANS, Scott R:

Chris, Balance limits are a 'maximum' so if your measurements fall anywhere
between zero and the limit, you're good. We've done extensive GVT (ground
vibration testing) and flight testing on the RV-10. The intent is to be
able to trim the weights according to the plans (if called out), bolt them
in and be well within the limits. We put the balance limits in the flight
test section because some builders alter the control surfaces during
construction...additional or different trim mechanisms, skin thicknesses
etc.

If your control surfaces are built according to the plans and your paint job
is not 'extreme', you should easily fall within the limits.

If you chose to check the balance, (excluding the rudder) you can just
disconnect the specific control surface from any control linkage (weight
elevators separately), get it in the level flight attitude and put a scale
under the trailing edge. The rudder would have to be removed, of course to
do this.

scott at van's

-Chris
#40072 (out of paint)

--


- The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum -
 

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
Back to top
Lew Gallagher



Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Posts: 402
Location: Greenville , SC

PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2011 5:24 am    Post subject: Re: Control surface balancing Reply with quote

Ahhh, it's in the TEST section! Thanks, I'll check it out.

More reason to know -- I'm closing in on experimenting with Linn's idea of using a microcontoller and high torque model airplane servos IN the aileron and rudder for trim. That would definitely change the balance, so I will find the axis of rotation, mount a counterbalance, etc. but I need that reference first.

Later, - Lew


- The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum -
 

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List

_________________
non-pilot
crazy about building
NOW OFICIALLY BUILDER #40549
Fly off completed !
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
rv10rob(at)gmail.com
Guest





PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2011 8:57 am    Post subject: Control surface balancing Reply with quote

FWIW, someone at Van's told me to just bolt the counterweights on as-is and don't worry about it. 
 
The tail-heavy limits for elevator balance listed in the flight test doc seem really generous.  I don't have paint yet, but even with paint, I'd be surprised if I got near the limit.
 
-Rob
On Thu, Apr 21, 2011 at 10:28 PM, John Gonzalez <indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com (indigoonlatigo(at)msn.com)> wrote:
[quote] Excellent, thank you for sharing the information!

Quote:
From: toaster73(at)embarqmail.com (toaster73(at)embarqmail.com)
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com (rv10-list(at)matronics.com)

Quote:
Subject: RE: RV10-List: Control surface balancing
Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2011 22:37:28 -0400

Quote:

--> RV10-List message posted by: "Chris" <toaster73(at)embarqmail.com (toaster73(at)embarqmail.com)>

>From VANS, Scott R:
>

Quote:
Chris, Balance limits are a 'maximum' so if your measurements fall anywhere
between zero and the limit, you're good. We've done extensive GVT (ground
vibration testing) and flight testing on the RV-10. The intent is to be
> able to trim the weights according to the plans (if called out), bolt them

Quote:
in and be well within the limits. We put the balance limits in the flight
test section because some builders alter the control surfaces during
> construction...additional or different trim mechanisms, skin thicknesses

Quote:
etc.

If your control surfaces are built according to the plans and your paint job
is not 'extreme', you should easily fall within the limits.
>

Quote:
If you chose to check the balance, (excluding the rudder) you can just
disconnect the specific control surface from any control linkage (weight
elevators separately), get it in the level flight attitude and put a scale
> under the trailing edge. The rudder would have to be removed, of course to

[quote] do this.

scott at van's

-Chris
#40072 (out of paint)

--


- The Matronics RV10-List Email Forum -
 

Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:

http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RV10-List
Back to top
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Matronics Email Lists Forum Index -> RV10-List All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group