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Nitrogen to compressed air

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Beegee5872

Joined: 06 Jul 2012
Posts: 13
Location: New York

Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 12:17 pm Post subject: Nitrogen to compressed air

Has anyone ever converted the main Nitrogen system to filtered compressed air for the L-29?



Bill G

_________________
Bill

jonboede(at)hotmail.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 1:07 pm Post subject: Nitrogen to compressed air

No worries but keep in mind that the dew point of industrial nitrogen is typically about -70C and the dew point of SCUBA air is -45C which sounds ok until you learn that there's 50 times as much moisture at a -45C dew point than at a -70C dew point.



It doesn't take much water to give you pneumatic system problems that will run you ragged trying to de-bug.



If you want to put compressed air in your L-29, make sure it's really dry... at least as dry as SCUBA air, but preferably a dew point -50C or lower.  (-52C has half the water that -45C has)

 	  Quote: 	
		   Subject: Nitrogen to compressed air

 From: Beegee5872(at)juno.com

 Date: Mon, 9 Jul 2012 13:17:17 -0700

 To: l29-list(at)matronics.com

 

 --> L29-List message posted by: "Beegee5872" <Beegee5872(at)juno.com>

 

 Has anyone ever converted the main Nitrogen system to filtered compressed air for the L-29?

 

 Bill G

 

 --------

 Bill

Beegee5872

Joined: 06 Jul 2012
Posts: 13
Location: New York

Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 3:42 pm Post subject: Re: Nitrogen to compressed air

Is there a preferred method to remove the water from the air/compressed air; prior to the storage tanks?



Bill G

_________________
Bill

czech6(at)mesanetworks.ne
Guest

Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 4:53 pm Post subject: Nitrogen to compressed air

Nope. Remove the bottles.

If renting bottles, nitro is cheaper than air.

When I was using air, I would have the fire dept or scuba shop fill my bottles. Easier just to use nitro. I converted all bottles, oxygen and nitro for brakes. 5 bottles. The three O2 bottles have a separate shutoff valve so they are isolated from the rest of the leaky system. Carry my own reserve.



Bill



On Jul 9, 2012, at 5:42 PM, "Beegee5872" <Beegee5872(at)juno.com> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 Is there a preferred method to remove the water from the air/compressed air; prior to the storage tanks?

 

 Bill G

 

 --------

 Bill

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377818#377818

Beegee5872

Joined: 06 Jul 2012
Posts: 13
Location: New York

Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 8:01 pm Post subject: Re: Nitrogen to compressed air

Is there a possibility of installing an electric air pump with a drying filter and automatic pressure regulator to maintain a constant air pressure to the storage without refilling the nitrogen (or compressed air) tank on the ground? 



Bill G

_________________
Bill

ncam(at)wave.co.nz
Guest

Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 10:14 pm Post subject: Nitrogen to compressed air

Yes,

        I used a dive tank to fill mine. If I lived in the land of the free, I would remove the N and O tanks and just use a dive tank, refillable cheap and tested for $30.00

Probably N is better but as a chemist I think that external exposure to O will occur anyhow, so the difference might not be too great. 

I would also want to change the brakes and wheels to Cleveland, but I don't live in the land of the free!

Neville

New Zealand

On 10/07/2012, at 8:17 AM, Beegee5872 wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 Has anyone ever converted the main Nitrogen system to filtered compressed air for the L-29?

 

 Bill G

 

 --------

 Bill

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377801#377801

czech6(at)mesanetworks.ne
Guest

Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 11:08 pm Post subject: Nitrogen to compressed air

People have done it (2) that I know of. Never will be as dry as nitrogen. 

I've used air for many years. No issues. But like I said, nitro is cheaper. All the way around.



Bill



On Jul 9, 2012, at 11:01 PM, "Beegee5872" <Beegee5872(at)juno.com> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 Is there a possibility of installing an electric air pump with a drying filter and automatic pressure regulator to maintain a constant air pressure to the storage without refilling the nitrogen (or compressed air) tank on the ground? 

 

 Bill G

 

 --------

 Bill

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377836#377836

jonboede(at)hotmail.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2012 6:19 am Post subject: Nitrogen to compressed air

There was a popular mod in L-39s to put in a vibrating pump to generate pressure to seal the canopies.



This went well until a couple of them burst into flames and filled the cockpits with smoke.



Your actual mileage will vary... but the longer I do this stuff (going on 11 years now) the fewer "improvements" I'm inclined to make to the old Soviet Technology.



Jon

 	  Quote: 	
		   Subject: Re: Nitrogen to compressed air

 From: Beegee5872(at)juno.com

 Date: Mon, 9 Jul 2012 21:01:37 -0700

 To: l29-list(at)matronics.com

 

 --> L29-List message posted by: "Beegee5872" <Beegee5872(at)juno.com>

 

 Is there a possibility of installing an electric air pump with a drying filter and automatic pressure regulator to maintain a constant air pressure to the storage without refilling the nitrogen (or compressed air) tank on the ground? 

 

 Bill G

 

 --------

 Bill

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=377836#377836


	




 		 	   		  

  [quote][b]

Beegee5872

Joined: 06 Jul 2012
Posts: 13
Location: New York

Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2012 11:37 am Post subject: Re: Nitrogen to compressed air

One would have thought that someone, some how, would design an on-board air pump for the L29 to push out 1200 to 2200 psi and not burst into flames to operate the front seal and braking system...

Though nitrogen is relatively cheap, to be tethered to that external hose at the next airport is disheartening

_________________
Bill

bculberson(at)staraviatio
Guest

Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2012 12:02 pm Post subject: Nitrogen to compressed air

I once thought that way, and now have to agree with Jon. The best thing I have done is to invest in a high frequency leak detector (Granger) and hunt down all those annoying leaks. 99% of them were 1/8th turns of a wrench of a system fitting. Now, my L-29 will hold 150 bars for 3-4 days and will stay above 50 bars for more than three weeks. If your system doesn't leak much, you won't use much. I have been using SCUBA air as that is the way I bought it with great luck. I put my air charge line in the nose compartment for trips; most cities have a SCUBA shop in case I somehow run out of air. I've been all over the south east and to Oshkosh twice from southern Alabama and never had a problem. If you convert to the high pressure Schrader valve and use Nitrogen, then any maintenance facility will have you covered.



Bill Culberson

N39DE



--

jorgen.nielsen(at)mweb.co
Guest

Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2012 12:55 pm Post subject: Nitrogen to compressed air

I sit somewhere in the middle of the 2 opinions..



Have also modified mine with a valve so I can close the air, that way when I

get to the aircraft she has the same amount of air as I left it.  Oxygen

tanks replaced and doing duty as 2nd system.



Onboard compressor has been done by an individual in Europe using an

electrically driven cornelius compressor in the nose (ex IFF) compartment. (

Hi Jean!)



Also been using scuba air for 7 years no problems.



I think it comes down to personal circumstance - i.e. what sort of airports

you fly to and therefore what sort of facilities you can expect.



Be careful that battery terminals are fully secured / covered in such a way

that they cannot be shorted by the metal part of the air charge hose.



Jorgen

--

propblast(at)earthlink.ne
Guest

Posted: Wed Jul 11, 2012 10:01 pm Post subject: Nitrogen to compressed air

How about just keeping the Nitrogen system the was it is and avoiding all those problems to begin with?



John Cabrera



On Jul 9, 2012, at 2:06 PM, Jon Boede wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  No worries but keep in mind that the dew point of industrial nitrogen is typically about -70C and the dew point of SCUBA air is -45C which sounds ok until you learn that there's 50 times as much moisture at a -45C dew point than at a -70C dew point.



It doesn't take much water to give you pneumatic system problems that will run you ragged trying to de-bug.



If you want to put compressed air in your L-29, make sure it's really dry... at least as dry as SCUBA air, but preferably a dew point -50C or lower.  (-52C has half the water that -45C has)

 	  Quote: 	
		   Subject: Nitrogen to compressed air

 From: Beegee5872(at)juno.com (Beegee5872(at)juno.com)

 Date: Mon, 9 Jul 2012 13:17:17 -0700

 To: l29-list(at)matronics.com (l29-list(at)matronics.com)

 

 --> L29-List message posted by: "Beegee5872" <Beegee5872(at)juno.com (Beegee5872(at)juno.com)>

 

 Has anyone ever converted the main Nitrogen system to filtered compressed air for the L-29?

 

 Bill G

 

 --------

 Bill


	


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Beegee5872

Joined: 06 Jul 2012
Posts: 13
Location: New York

Posted: Mon Jul 23, 2012 2:30 pm Post subject: Re: Nitrogen to compressed air

Has anyone ever used a combination set-up of nitrogen and air pump, that is starting with the 150 bar and a backing it with an air pump by use of a plumbing 'T' 



What is the average of number of landings/braking and taxing on a full tank of nitrogen at a typical GA airport?



Bill

_________________
Bill

ncam(at)wave.co.nz
Guest

Posted: Mon Jul 23, 2012 10:32 pm Post subject: Nitrogen to compressed air

Two

Neville

On 24/07/2012, at 10:30 AM, Beegee5872 wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 Has anyone ever used a combination set-up of nitrogen and air pump, that is starting with the 150 bar and a backing it with an air pump by use of a plumbing 'T' 

 

 What is the average of number of landings/braking and taxing on a full tank of nitrogen at a typical GA airport?

 

 Bill

 

 --------

 Bill

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=379024#379024

czech6(at)mesanetworks.ne
Guest

Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 3:13 am Post subject: Nitrogen to compressed air

A student can usually get about 6-7 landings. All in one day so it doesn't leak.



Bill



On Jul 23, 2012, at 5:30 PM, "Beegee5872" <Beegee5872(at)juno.com> wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 Has anyone ever used a combination set-up of nitrogen and air pump, that is starting with the 150 bar and a backing it with an air pump by use of a plumbing 'T' 

 

 What is the average of number of landings/braking and taxing on a full tank of nitrogen at a typical GA airport?

 

 Bill

 

 --------

 Bill

 

 

 

 

 Read this topic online here:

 

 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=379024#379024

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