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Elevator in trail

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carl.froehlich(at)verizon
Guest

Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 9:27 am Post subject: Elevator in trail

Just short of 30 hours on N7ZK.  Attached photo is of the elevator horn in level flight.  As you can see, the elevator trailing edge is slightly down.  This implies the HS is creating too much downward force and the elevator is adding upward force to compensate.  The question for the group is would it be worthwhile to add a shim under the forward HS spar – say .040” or so to correct for this, or is it close enough?  This is solo, so any weight in the back would, I assume, make the issue more pronounced.

 

Carl

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jchang10

Joined: 05 Jul 2006
Posts: 227

Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 10:14 am Post subject: Elevator in trail

That is perfectly normal. Looks identical to mine in cruise. Not an     aeronautical engineer, but i believe the CG moves aft as speed     increases. Also, i think it's designed that way for greater     efficiency, as there is less downforce on the HS creating a greater     net lifting force of the plane overall.

     

     Jae

     

     On 7/29/2012 10:26 AM, Carl Froehlich wrote:     [quote]                       <![endif]-->   <![endif]-->                

Just short             of 30 hours on N7ZK.  Attached photo is of the elevator horn             in level flight.  As you can see, the elevator trailing edge             is slightly down.  This implies the HS is creating too much             downward force and the elevator is adding upward force to             compensate.  The question for the group is would it be             worthwhile to add a shim under the forward HS spar – say             .040” or so to correct for this, or is it close enough?              This is solo, so any weight in the back would, I assume,             make the issue more pronounced.         

          

Carl       

     -- 

#40533 RV-10

First flight 10/19/2011

Phase 1 Done 11/26/2011

do not archive[b]

_________________
#40533 RV-10
First flight 10/19/2011
Phase 1 Done 11/26/2011

Bob Turner

Joined: 03 Jan 2009
Posts: 885
Location: Castro Valley, CA

Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 12:35 pm Post subject: Re: Elevator in trail

I'd urge caution. If you reduce the downward force the tail can generate you might find yourself landing nose wheel first, especially at forward cg.

_________________
Bob Turner
RV-10 QB

carl.froehlich(at)verizon
Guest

Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 12:58 pm Post subject: Elevator in trail

Thought about that, but as is solo (the most forward CG that I will have) I

have a lot of nose up trim left on landing.



Carl 



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woxofswa

Joined: 12 Aug 2008
Posts: 349
Location: AZ

Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 8:04 pm Post subject: Re: Elevator in trail

I don't have one in front of me, but I seem to recall seeing ad pictures of the yellow RV10 demonstrator in magazines wherein you see a bunch of the elevator counterweight protruding up.  I always thought that was odd.

_________________
Myron Nelson
Mesa, AZ
Flew May 10 2014

Kellym

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1705
Location: Sun Lakes AZ

Posted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 9:08 pm Post subject: Elevator in trail

Well, most every Mooney I have flown in has a more pronounced elevator 

displacement during cruise. I don't think you are going to get 

perfection on angle of incidence to the point you get rid of elevator 

displacement. Maybe could be done for one specific wt and cruise speed, 

but would be out for anything else.



On 7/29/2012 9:04 PM, woxofswa wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   



 I don't have one in front of me, but I seem to recall seeing ad pictures of the yellow RV10 demonstrator in magazines wherein you see a bunch of the elevator counterweight protruding up.  I always thought that was odd.



 --------

 Myron Nelson

 Mesa, AZ

 Emp completed, QB wings completed, legacy build fuse in mostly done, finishing kit in progress.





 Read this topic online here:



 http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=379549#379549

_________________
Kelly McMullen
A&P/IA, EAA Tech Counselor # 5286
KCHD

toaster73(at)embarqmail.c
Guest

Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 4:41 am Post subject: Elevator in trail

Consider a stabilator - all moving tail, I wonder how you tell where one of

those is supposed to be in cruise?? 



-Chris



N919AR



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Strasnuts

Joined: 10 Feb 2009
Posts: 502
Location: Salt Lake City, UT

Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 5:21 am Post subject: Elevator in trail

Stick force.



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_________________
40936
RV-10 SB N801VR Flying
780 Hours
SuperSTOL 60 hours

Kellym

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1705
Location: Sun Lakes AZ

Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 6:08 am Post subject: Elevator in trail

The Mooney uses an all moving tail, including the vertical stab. It is 

like any other tail setup, you trim for neutral forces.

Where the elevator winds up is apparently a function of c.g. mostly. To 

have a longitudinally stable aircraft the tail has to be generating some 

downforce, it can't be neutral.



On 7/30/2012 5:40 AM, Chris wrote:

[quote] 



 Consider a stabilator - all moving tail, I wonder how you tell where one of

 those is supposed to be in cruise??



 -Chris



 N919AR



 --

_________________
Kelly McMullen
A&P/IA, EAA Tech Counselor # 5286
KCHD

rv10flyer(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 6:28 am Post subject: Elevator in trail

Probably already covered. Been flying so not following this thread.

Tim made comment on this on his page- 

http://www.myrv10.com/N104CD/maintenance/20080622/index.html



My plane flies great, don't lose too much time worrying about this.. keep 

building!

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rv10flyer

Joined: 25 Aug 2009
Posts: 364

Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 4:44 pm Post subject: Re: Elevator in trail

Solo or hauling the family, mine does not change position much. Like yours, slightly above at 160 ktas. I would leave it alone.

_________________
Wayne G.

toaster73(at)embarqmail.c
Guest

Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 5:51 pm Post subject: Elevator in trail

My comment was tongue in cheek - hard to show on email.

-Chris



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