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f.kyle(at)sympatico.ca
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 Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2013 8:28 am Post subject: You'll cry....... |
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Cheers,
Before I begin this chronicle, I beg you - do not open unless
you have a modicum of forbearance and compassion. Do not open within 2 hours
of eating. This article is based on my Mono, but detachable wings make it
a Europa item for all who crave enjoyment
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asc23111964(at)hotmail.co
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| Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2013 1:53 pm Post subject: You'll cry....... |
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Hi Ferg,
I cannot see your pictures in the message,so I'm struggling to fathom what exactly happened,other than you've got the
Wings stuck on and cannot remove them.
Were you in the bonding process for glueing in bushes?
ie 1370lb mod?
Did the port wing move rearwards to jam up because you hadn't got the spar rigging guide reduxed onto the bottom of the port fuselage side aperture?
It maybe the case you may have to cut the top off the module,remove the fuel tank and drift the 'pins' out forwards,
Drastic though this may seem,I'm struggling to see another
solution at the moment,putting a saw close to the spar is fraught with the possibility of damaging it in a critical area.
With our Tri-gear Europa xs G-CGDH,we are using two "pip"
Pins,as opposed to the clumsy looking pin with the "lock latch".
Removing the tank doesn't seem to be too bad a job,as I've seen pics in a Europa club magazine of a tank replacement.
Just wondering if Bud Yerly can advise you,he's pretty good.
Best Regards
Andy Cullum.
Sent from my iPhone
On 5 Jun 2013, at 17:33, f.kyle(at)sympatico.ca (f.kyle(at)sympatico.ca) wrote:
[quote] <![endif]--> <![endif]-->
Cheers,
Before I begin this chronicle, I beg you - do not open unless you have a modicum of forbearance and compassion. Do not open within 2 hours of eating. This article is based on my Mono, but detachable wings make it a Europa item for all who crave enjoyment
.
NOTE: Due to size restrictions, addenda, sketches and photos follow in âYouâll cry 2â. I used âADJUNCTâ to describe various items.
After 15 years of building and boasting, I got the fuselage out of the spare bedroom, and up to the airport to match with the wings. Life improved at home markedly, but the wings were not obedient - perhaps because they had waited through two winters while the fuselage lay in relative comfort.
Attaching the wings, there was a marked âthunkâ when the port pip-pin began its entry. I noticed that it was in only one inch or so, and surmised that the port spar was the reticent item. While I was cursing and sweating at this event, a buddy came across the hangar and slid the starboard pin in, slick as a whistle.
I mused as to how to react ,and after some consultation with the burgeoning Advisory Board (casually forming at the hangar), calculated that a âtapered spindleâ, suitably divided into sections would easily (a) urge the bushings on the port side to align as it entered, (b) if properly sectioned, would fall in sections into the belly (for recovery), when pressed forward into the dark, (c) as the pip-pin was installed in trail. The bushings would then become accustomed to their fates and obey in future.
I designed the item in question - see Adjunct A [see PINTLE2, attached} - and asked Heinz at the warplane to fashion it. The idea was that the sections would follow one another because of a centring pin guaranteeing concentricity.
Now to the design: I tried to measure the free distance from the back of the starboard spar bushing to the fuel tank forward face, as to be the free space into which the sections would fall after passing through.
The opportunity to do this was badly restricted by (1) my loss of many sketches I made and stored on the computor. This latter dimmed in utility and I âupgradedâ (I think they call it). Despite a thousand oaths of purity, the family computer agent lost many sketches, including measurements now hidden in the completed fuselage. Let the court examine the drawings in chapters called âFuel Tankâ (my #16) and are titled Fig.2 âStrap baggage bay to maintain desired positionâ and Fig. 3, âSectional view through centreline of tankâ., or see below as Adjuncts (B) and (C). [ADJUNCT(B) is SpindleMaster, attached] [ADJUNCT (C) is PORTwingBOLT3, attached]
Back to the design. This was completed after a long day, at about 11:45 pm. I callipered the space across the tank bottom and scaled the drawing to calculate the space behind the spar bushings to the tank forward face to establish the length of the front section of the spindle for its fall on reaching freedom - see item (b), para 4 above. As Adjunct (A) shows it came to 4.75 inches with 5/8 inches of space remaining. Plenty.....
The device was produced by my buddy Heinz at the Warplane Heritage Museum across the bay. Heinz reversed the connecting pin between sections (for centring purposes) Itâs shown as dotted red in ADJUNCT (C). Back to para 3 and the âthunkâ. In that split second, I realised what had happened. In my torpor, I had transcribed 2-3/4 inches to 4-3/4 inches in the plan. The spindle had thumped the fuel tank and was now jammed part-way into the spars and stuck - - and so was I.
The present state, as displayed in Adjunct (C) was drawn full-size. At right the Port pip-pin shows the thickness of spars and seat bulkhead to be correct..... the relative thickness of bulkhead and spars might be incorrect, but the total was right. Now, the effect of the reversed Heinz inter-section pin became clear. Instead of a depression into which I might drill and tap a thread to hold a retracting threaded rod, Iâm looking at the pin. I used the front sections of the spindle to guide a smaller drill bit into the pin. However, it was perhaps 0.5 mm off centre and some of the pin remained erect. As I continued, I felt the bit snag the face of the spindle and it rotated. With the other end snug against the tank, I panicked that perhaps I was drilling a hole in the tank. I blanched even further.
I am now being educated as to what lies in that sacred cavern - aileron roll mechanisms, two spars, the pitch control tube and several sets of nuts and bolts with which to contend. None of these devices seem to be shown in relative/measured position - and I canât see to look in.
If youâre still with me, see Adjunct (D), [PINTLEsite.jpg, attached] a print of the spindle in situ, courtesy of Alâs boroscope. Yup, there are the twin scars of an attempt to handsaw the 3/8 inch (+/-) stainless steel spindle, oh, and a single rut produced when it was the other way around.
So there you have it. That is the present state of affairs. An expert here banned the use of a moderate-sized reciprocating saw - as bestial - prepared blade is Adjunct (E). ADJUNCT (F) is P5090153.JPG, attached, and is an extended hacksaw blade arm with about 2 inches of teeth exposed - used by hand to dig two of those ruts in the pintle in the boroscope view. I am contemplating welding a long arm with 2 inches of hacksaw blade at the business end and a jig saw attached outside the belly panel hole. One must remember that the pip-pin is about 2 inches from the outer skin, so a reciprocator must not have a larger range of travel. Thatâs why the expert banned the âSawzallâ as they call it and I reverted to the other choice (F).
If you have come this far, you must have an opinion - not of me, thatâs assumed - but of the solution. If so, let me have it. Otherwise, you may want to haunt this site hoping to hear of another choice later. In the meantime, please tell me the width of the spars and the depth of the seat back, and any photo of the spar entry holes (port side) so I can visualise the contents of same.
As the Old Guy said, âI have to close now as I hear Sister coming upstairs with that (at)#$%^& syringeâ.
Cheers, Ferg
[quote][b]
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rlborger(at)mac.com
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| Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2013 3:36 pm Post subject: You'll cry....... |
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Ferg,
Like Andrew, I can't see the pictures so there's a bit of a problem visualizing your predicament.
When I put my wings on the first time at the airport, the wing bushings refused to align themselves with bushings in the cockpit module. This is in spit of the fact I had the wings on and off several times during the build and the seemed to fit quite well. I'm not sure exactly why, but they were off by just enough that the big pip pin and the solid pin refused to enter. I was able to estimate that the wing bushings were short of alignment by something between 1/16 & 1/32 inch. I fashioned up a set of pins to assist in the alignment. The pins were fabricated from 1/2 inch round bar stock. Here is a picture of the two pins along with the solid pin supplied by Europa:
The taper on the insertion end ensured that the pin entered the bushings and coaxed them into alignment. Once both pins were in, one could be removed and replaced with either a pip pin or the solid pin. With one proper pin in place, the other taper pin could be removed and replaced with a proper pin.
Like Andrew, I also use two pip pins rather than the big solid pin.
The scale and squares in the picture are 1" so you can determine the various dimensions of the pins.
As for removal of the stuck pintle, I'm at a loss until I can see just how it's configured and how it's stuck. I'd avoid cutting anything for access until you had an opportunity to correspond with Bud. He's the real Guru and if anyone can come up with a solution, he should be able.
Blue skies & tailwinds,
Bob Borger
Europa XS Tri, Rotax 914, Airmaster C/S Prop.
Little Toot Sport Biplane, Lycoming Thunderbolt AEIO-320 EXP
3705 Lynchburg Dr.
Corinth, TX 76208-5331
Cel: 817-992-1117
rlborger(at)mac.com
On Jun 5, 2013, at 11:30 AM, f.kyle(at)sympatico.ca wrote:
Cheers,
Before I begin this chronicle, I beg you - do not open unless you have a modicum of forbearance and compassion. Do not open within 2 hours of eating. This article is based on my Mono, but detachable wings make it a Europa item for all who crave enjoyment
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neveyre(at)aol.com
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| Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2013 11:12 pm Post subject: You'll cry....... |
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Hi Ferg, I couldn't see any pictures ?
If what you have are steel pins with no heads, stuck in the bores of the fuselage / wing spar bushes, here is one possible solution.
Auto body shops will have weld on studs for pulling dents out of body skins, bit like the shanks of pop rivets. They are welded on a bit like spot welding, not too much heat generated.
These are then attached to a slide hammer to pull out the dent.
If you can get a wire through the seatback bush, to one side to make a ground to the pin, and get the stud welded onto the middle of your pin, you may have half a chance to pull the pin out with the slide hammer.
Get someone on the wing tip to wiggle up and down the same time as pulling the pin.
Good luck,
Cheers,
Nev
--
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Fred Klein
Joined: 26 Mar 2012
Posts: 503
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| Posted: Thu Jun 06, 2013 12:41 pm Post subject: You'll cry....... |
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Ferg...there is a space of 1.75" (45mm) between the face of my tank and the aft edge of the 0.5" rod which connects to the aileron friction plate. I'm suggesting that this gap would allow ample space for a reciprocating saw blade of proper length to saw your pintle from below...the trick will be to establish some reference points so that the opening for the saw can be determined with some accuracy.
My suggestion would be to use a hole saw to cut a hole in the bottom of the fuselage...say about 2" in diameter...if you make hatch marks for the center point extending beyond the circumference of the circle, they would make it easy to align the cut-out circle when you go to patch it in once the problem's solved and your wings are off.
To locate the center point of your hole, perhaps starting from a reference line drawn between the two fuel tank access holes would do...?...if this sounds like a sensible approach to you (and to others lurking on the list), I can give you a dimension fore and aft from that line, and a second dimension off the centerline of the fuselage
bottom to locate the center point for the hole.
Let me know if you would like me to determine those dimensions and establish that point.
My suggestions are based on the idea that a solution lies in finding a way to cut off your "tapered pintle" which will then allow for you to drive out the remaining portion which is now stuck in the spar holes.
But perhaps more experienced minds can find a better alternative.
Fred
On Jun 6, 2013, at 11:06 AM, <f.kyle(at)sympatico.ca (f.kyle(at)sympatico.ca)> <f.kle(at)sympatico.ca (f.kle(at)sympatico.ca)> wrote:
[quote]Fred, If the photo trip is for me, I am chuffed to think you would doso. However to save time and digits, I am lookig for the space you mention, i.e: up to three inches inward from the port skin, above and below the pip-pin level, as that seems most probable. Also I have little idea of the bits and pieces overhead the spars as well as underneath. These may be useful for you too once the wings are on.Salaam, Ferg
From: Fred Klein [mailto:fklein(at)orcasonline.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2013 12:28 PM
To: f.kyle(at)sympatico.caf.kyle(at)sympatico.ca
Subject: Re: You'll cry.......
Ferg...
Once again I'll say that your sketches are exquisite and quite illuminating as to the situation you face...by all means send them to everyone who's commented on your dilemma. My wings are presently not installed, so I will head out to my shop w/ my camera and perhaps can describe things visually from another perspective.
Right now, I'm thinking that a possible solution might lie in a small penetration in the bottom of your fuselage into which is inserted a reciprocating blade of the proper length...but let me get back to you w/ more information.
Fred
On Jun 6, 2013, at 6:49 AM, <f.kyle(at)sympatico.ca (f.kyle(at)sympatico.ca)> <f.kyle(at)sympatico.ca (f.kyle(at)sympatico.ca)> wrote:
Fred,
Sorry, got so wrapped up in it, forgot the Matronics restrictions. If youre still curious, here are the phoyos, minus two of extended saw blades, one of which may be my last option....
Ferg
<PINTLE2.JPG><SpindleMaster.JPG><PORTwingBOLT3.JPG><PINTLEsite.JPG>[b]
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