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Tundra10
Joined: 14 Jun 2010
Posts: 102
Location: Scarborough, Ontario
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 Posted: Mon Oct 07, 2013 7:12 pm Post subject: Ray Allen position sensors |
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I would like the Dynon Skyview to record the position of my ailerons
and elevators.
Has anyone used the Ray Allen position sensors for this ?
Are they suitable for the continuous movement, or will they wear out ?
Do they provide mechanical resistance that would be felt as drag on
the control stick ?
How much off axis motion will the plunger accept before binding ?
Alternatively, are there any automotive products that might be
suitable, such as throttle position sensors ? The one used on my
vehicle would be impractical to mount.
Thanks,
Jeff Page
Dream Aircraft Tundra #10
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user9253
Joined: 28 Mar 2008
Posts: 1938
Location: Riley TWP Michigan
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jluckey(at)pacbell.net
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| Posted: Tue Oct 08, 2013 7:02 am Post subject: Ray Allen position sensors |
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Jeff,
2 devices pop immediately to mind: a potentiometer (pot) or rotary encoder (like the TPS uses).
But first a few questions:
1. where do you want to mount the sensor?
-somewhere near the aileron
-near the bell crank
-near aileron axis of the stick
-??
2. what type of input does the Dynon have for this purpose. Is it expecting an analog voltage or a string of bits?
With a pot, it is trivial to deliver an analog voltage proportional to surface deflection. With a rotary encoder you will need some circuitry.
As far as connecting linkages & arms, you might look into RC model aircraft hardware. There are all kinds of arms, clevises, ball links, etc that could do the job. See these links for starters:
http://www.servocity.com/html/servo_power_gearbox_arms.html
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0095p?FVPROFIL=&FVSEARCH=aluminum+servo+arms&search=Go
From: Jeff Page <jpx(at)qenesis.com>
To: Aero_Electric_List <aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com>
Sent: Monday, October 7, 2013 8:12 PM
Subject: Ray Allen position sensors
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jeff Page <jpx(at)qenesis.com (jpx(at)qenesis.com)>
I would like the Dynon Skyview to record the position of my ailerons and elevators.
Has anyone used the Ray Allen position sensors for this ?
Are they suitable for the continuous movement, or will they wear out ?
Do they provide mechanical resistance that would be felt as drag on the control stick ?
How much off axis motion will the plunger accept before binding ?
Alternatively, are there any automotive products that might be suitable, such as throttle position sensors ? The one used on my vehicle would be impractical to mount.
Thanks,
Jeff Page
Dream Air Use the Matronics List p; &n
[quote][b]
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Tundra10
Joined: 14 Jun 2010
Posts: 102
Location: Scarborough, Ontario
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| Posted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 5:22 am Post subject: Ray Allen position sensors |
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Jeff,
The most likely place for an aileron or elevator connection is to the
bellcrank in the wing (aileron) and under the cabin floor (elevator).
So the end of the rod connected to the bellcrank will swing an arc and
the other end of the rod would connect to the sensor. The Ray Allen
sensor might work, but only if it doesn't mind the slightly off axis
forces and the continuous motion (higher wear rate than a trim or flap
indicator).
If the Ray Allen is unsuitable, than another potentiometer device
would work, since the Dynon has analog 0-5V inputs. That open
possibilities of automotive throttle position sensors etc., but most
will likely be harder to mount and connect a rod to.
Joe Gores hall effect device has possibilities I will need to look
into (Thanks Joe !), although it looks like I might need to find a way
to temperature compensate it.
Jeff Page
Dream Aircraft Tundra #10
| Quote: | From: Jeff Luckey <jluckey(at)pacbell.net>
Subject: Re: Ray Allen position sensors
Jeff,
2 devices pop immediately to mind: a potentiometer (pot) or rotary encoder
(like the TPS uses).
But first a few questions. Where do you want to mount the sensor ? -somewhere
near the aileron -near the bell crank -near aileron axis of the stick ??
What type of input does the Dynon have for this purpose ? - Is it
expecting an
analog voltage or a string of bits?
With a pot, it is trivial to deliver an analog voltage proportional
to surface
deflection. - With a rotary encoder you will need some circuitry. As far as
connecting linkages & arms, you might look into RC model aircraft hardware.
There are all kinds of arms, clevises, ball links, etc that could do the job
See these links for starters:
http://www.servocity.com/html/servo_power_gearbox_arms.html
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0095p?FVPROFIL=&FVSEARCH=aluminum+servo+arms&search=Go
|
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jluckey(at)pacbell.net
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:39 am Post subject: Ray Allen position sensors |
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Well, that makes it easy -- a 5-volt regulator, 10k pot driven from the bell crank & you're in business...
From: Jeff Page <jpx(at)qenesis.com>
To: aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 9, 2013 6:22 AM
Subject: Re: Ray Allen position sensors
--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: Jeff Page <jpx(at)qenesis.com (jpx(at)qenesis.com)>
Jeff,
The most likely place for an aileron or elevator connection is to the bellcrank in the wing (aileron) and under the cabin floor (elevator). So the end of the rod connected to the bellcrank will swing an arc and the other end of the rod would connect to the sensor. The Ray Allen sensor might work, but only if it doesn't mind the slightly off axis forces and the continuous motion (higher wear rate than a trim or flap indicator).
If the Ray Allen is unsuitable, than another potentiometer device would work, since the Dynon has analog 0-5V inputs. That open possibilities of automotive throttle position sensors etc., but most will likely be harder to mount and connect a rod to.
Joe Gores hall effect device has possibilities I will need to look into (Thanks Joe !), although it looks like I might need to find a way to temperature compensate it.
Jeff Page
Dream Aircraft Tundra #10
| Quote: | From: Jeff Luckey <jluckey(at)pacbell.net (jluckey(at)pacbell.net)>
Subject: Re: Ray Allen position sensors
Jeff,
2 devices pop immediately to mind: a potentiometer (pot) or rotary encoder
(like the TPS uses).
But first a few questions. Where do you want to mount the sensor ? -somewhere
near the aileron -near the bell crank -near aileron axis of the stick ??
What type of input does the Dynon have for this purpose ? - Is it expecting an
analog voltage or a string of bits?
With a pot, it is trivial to deliver an analog voltage proportional to surface
deflection. - With a rotary encoder you will need some circuitry. As far as
connecting linkages & arms, you might look into RC model aircraft hardware.
There are all kinds of arms, clevises, ball links, etc that could do the job
See these links for starters:
http://www.servocity.com/html/servo_power_gearbox_arms.html
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0095p?FVPROFIL=&FVSEARCH=aluminum+servo+arms&am; sp; -================
|
[quote][b]
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retasker(at)optonline.net
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 8:41 am Post subject: Ray Allen position sensors |
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I am not sure about the Ray Allen position sensors, but if you do use a pot, make sure it is one designed to be used in
such an application where it will be almost continuously adjusted. All pots have a projected life before they start
acting flaky (technical term  ). Some are designed to be continuously adjusted, others are intended to be used only
occasionally.
While what you are contemplating is not a safety of flight issue, at least how I interpret what you want to do, it would
be a pain if you had to replace the pot every few months because it wore out and responded erratically.
Dick Tasker
Jeff Luckey wrote:
| Quote: | Well, that makes it easy -- a 5-volt regulator, 10k pot driven from the bell crank & you're in business...
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From:* Jeff Page <jpx(at)qenesis.com>
*To:* aeroelectric-list(at)matronics.com
*Sent:* Wednesday, October 9, 2013 6:22 AM
*Subject:* Re: Ray Allen position sensors
Jeff,
The most likely place for an aileron or elevator connection is to the bellcrank in the wing (aileron) and under the
cabin floor (elevator). So the end of the rod connected to the bellcrank will swing an arc and the other end of the
rod would connect to the sensor. The Ray Allen sensor might work, but only if it doesn't mind the slightly off axis
forces and the continuous motion (higher wear rate than a trim or flap indicator).
If the Ray Allen is unsuitable, than another potentiometer device would work, since the Dynon has analog 0-5V inputs.
That open possibilities of automotive throttle position sensors etc., but most will likely be harder to mount and
connect a rod to.
Joe Gores hall effect device has possibilities I will need to look into (Thanks Joe !), although it looks like I might
need to find a way to temperature compensate it.
Jeff Page
Dream Aircraft Tundra #10
> From: Jeff Luckey <jluckey(at)pacbell.net <mailto:jluckey(at)pacbell.net>>
> Subject: Re: Ray Allen position sensors
>
> Jeff,
>
> 2 devices pop immediately to mind: a potentiometer (pot) or rotary encoder
> (like the TPS uses).
> But first a few questions. Where do you want to mount the sensor ? -somewhere
> near the aileron -near the bell crank -near aileron axis of the stick ??
> What type of input does the Dynon have for this purpose ? - Is it expecting an
> analog voltage or a string of bits?
> With a pot, it is trivial to deliver an analog voltage proportional to surface
> deflection. - With a rotary encoder you will need some circuitry. As far as
> connecting linkages & arms, you might look into RC model aircraft hardware.
> There are all kinds of arms, clevises, ball links, etc that could do the job
> See these links for starters:
> http://www.servocity.com/html/servo_power_gearbox_arms.html
> http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0095p?FVPROFIL=&FVSEARCH=aluminum+servo+arms&am; sp;
-================
*
*
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user9253
Joined: 28 Mar 2008
Posts: 1938
Location: Riley TWP Michigan
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| Posted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 3:27 pm Post subject: Re: Ray Allen position sensors |
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The Ray Allen pot can be mounted with a hinge. Then there will be no sideways force.
I bought one of those hall effect sensors to play with. One end of a magnet will make the output voltage go up. The other end of the magnet will make the output voltage go down. I think that a horseshoe magnet will give the largest output range as the magnet moves. The magnet will have to be located near the control pivot point because it only needs to move a fraction of an inch.
Another possibility is to use hall effect switches or magnetic reed switches.
Joe
| | - The Matronics AeroElectric-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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Joe Gores |
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