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Baggage compartment

 
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smokey_bear_40220(at)yaho
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 02, 2006 11:12 pm    Post subject: Baggage compartment Reply with quote

Probably just me, but it is the baggage floor on those
tiny little weld mounts just above the elevator push
rod that bothers me the most when I am loaded anywhere
near 150 lbs. 3.8 x 150 = 570 lbs.

Sure the baggage fabric carries some of the load to
its mounts, but those tiny weldments..... Just wish I
added a few extra braces for peace of mind, I suppose.
Did anyone ever do that?

Kurt S. S-5

Do not archive

--- jdmcbean <jdmcbean(at)cableone.net> wrote:

Quote:
......................
FYI.. The engine mount, baggage area even the
horizontal tail surface was load tested.

Fly Safe !!
John McBean
www.sportplanellc.com
"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"


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dan(at)azshowersolutions.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2006 5:41 am    Post subject: Baggage compartment Reply with quote

Kurt,
It may be a little tough if you already have your bird covered, but have you thought of building a floor in over the pushrod? Built with aluminum angle and held in place with adel clamps. If interested I can send a few pictures...contact off site.
Dan B
Mesa, AZ
www.azshowersolutions.com/Kitfox1.html

kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220(at)yahoo.com> wrote:


Probably just me, but it is the baggage floor on those
tiny little weld mounts just above the elevator push
rod that bothers me the most when I am loaded anywhere
near 150 lbs. 3.8 x 150 = 570 lbs.

Sure the baggage fabric carries some of the load to
its mounts, but those tiny weldments..... Just wish I
added a few extra braces for peace of mind, I suppose.
Did anyone ever do that?

Kurt S. S-5

Do not archive

--- jdmcbean wrote:

Quote:
......................
FYI.. The engine mount, baggage area even the
horizontal tail surface was load tested.

Fly Safe !!
John McBean
www.sportplanellc.com
"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"


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kingjohne(at)adelphia.net
Guest





PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2006 3:42 pm    Post subject: Baggage compartment Reply with quote

Kurt,

That bothered me when I was building my Series 6. Also I did not like
the fabric sides as a support to contain shifting cargo in turbulence.
I decided to remove the fabric entirely and designed solid sides and a
back end with removal 3/32-inch aircraft grade plywood. The plywood
sides and bottom also supported the cargo deck. It turned into a much
more sturdier cargo bay.

--
John King
Warrenton, VA
kurt schrader wrote:

Quote:


Probably just me, but it is the baggage floor on those
tiny little weld mounts just above the elevator push
rod that bothers me the most when I am loaded anywhere
near 150 lbs. 3.8 x 150 = 570 lbs.

Sure the baggage fabric carries some of the load to
its mounts, but those tiny weldments..... Just wish I
added a few extra braces for peace of mind, I suppose.
Did anyone ever do that?

Kurt S. S-5

Do not archive

--- jdmcbean <jdmcbean(at)cableone.net> wrote:



>......................
>FYI.. The engine mount, baggage area even the
>horizontal tail surface was load tested.
>
>Fly Safe !!
>John McBean
>www.sportplanellc.com
>"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"
>
>








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bnn(at)nethere.com
Guest





PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2006 4:01 pm    Post subject: Baggage compartment Reply with quote

At 11:05 PM 3/2/2006, you wrote:
Quote:
Probably just me, but it is the baggage floor on those
tiny little weld mounts just above the elevator push
rod that bothers me the most when I am loaded anywhere
near 150 lbs. 3.8 x 150 = 570 lbs.

I did just that, except being a IV I designed it for about 6x40 =
240lb at ultimate, (failure). I then tested it by climbing in and jumping
up and down on it. (I weigh about 195, so needed some G's.)
You definitely should be bothered by the proximity of the control
rod. A failure of the baggage floor could ruin your whole day. I know some
say it's not easy to hit 3.8 g's, but when I was doing aerobatic training I
found it quite easy. Six is more difficult, but if you're flying at or near
Vne it's supposedly rather easy. (Some birds are ultra strong and Vne is
set by flutter considerations. I personally do not believe my IV is over
strong, (the spherical bearings at the outboard strut ends are marginal,)
so suspect Vne may be a structural limit. (Note discussion of motor mounts
elsewhere.))
Guy Buchanan
K-IV 1200 / 582 / 99.9% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.


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smokey_bear_40220(at)yaho
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2006 8:07 pm    Post subject: Baggage compartment Reply with quote

Thanks John,

Did you fasten the wood to the upper tubing with Adel
clemps, or what? Any other supports added? Did it
add much weight? I suppose it is removable. I'll do
an upgrade on that later on my plane.

Kurt S.

--- John King <kingjohne(at)adelphia.net> wrote:

Quote:
Kurt,

That bothered me when I was building my Series 6.
Also I did not like
the fabric sides as a support to contain shifting
cargo in turbulence.
I decided to remove the fabric entirely and designed
solid sides and a
back end with removal 3/32-inch aircraft grade
plywood. The plywood
sides and bottom also supported the cargo deck. It
turned into a much more sturdier cargo bay.

--
John King
Warrenton, VA


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janderson412(at)hotmail.c
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2006 8:07 pm    Post subject: Baggage compartment Reply with quote

The thing with cargo in a/c is that it MUST be tethered...so long as the
base (floor) is strong enough and secure. On my 5 I have secured the
baggage floor to the fuse mounts with ring top bolts and have a securing net
and tie downs.
John A.
Series 5 EA 81 Intercooled Turbo


From: John King <kingjohne(at)adelphia.net>
Reply-To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com
To: kitfox-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Baggage compartment
Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2006 18:41:06 -0500


Kurt,

That bothered me when I was building my Series 6. Also I did not like
the fabric sides as a support to contain shifting cargo in turbulence.
I decided to remove the fabric entirely and designed solid sides and a
back end with removal 3/32-inch aircraft grade plywood. The plywood
sides and bottom also supported the cargo deck. It turned into a much
more sturdier cargo bay.

--
John King
Warrenton, VA
kurt schrader wrote:

Quote:

<smokey_bear_40220(at)yahoo.com>

Probably just me, but it is the baggage floor on those
tiny little weld mounts just above the elevator push
rod that bothers me the most when I am loaded anywhere
near 150 lbs. 3.8 x 150 = 570 lbs.

Sure the baggage fabric carries some of the load to
its mounts, but those tiny weldments..... Just wish I
added a few extra braces for peace of mind, I suppose.
Did anyone ever do that?

Kurt S. S-5

Do not archive

--- jdmcbean <jdmcbean(at)cableone.net> wrote:

>......................
>FYI.. The engine mount, baggage area even the
>horizontal tail surface was load tested.
>
>Fly Safe !!
>John McBean
>www.sportplanellc.com
>"The Sky is not the Limit... It's a Playground"




Discover fun and games at (at) http://xtramsn.co.nz/kids


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smokey_bear_40220(at)yaho
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2006 8:25 pm    Post subject: Baggage compartment Reply with quote

Thanks Guy,

I need to improve that cargo area. I would be
uncomfortable risking sitting on my cargo floor. As
for now, I keep it limited to 135 lbs and that loaded
forward because the elevator tube could rub.

You are right about wing strut ends too. Mine had to
have the upgraded bolts to use 1550# gross. And there
are those few components that have no redundancy that
you better check every preflight and every annual too.

As for G's, it is amazing what one can achieve when
distracted. When I flew A-4's, I remember a certain
flight doing air combat maneuverine (ACM) in
particular. The "enemy" was behind me. I was flying
at full power, left hand on the stick upside down
(thumb down and elbow up) spun around in my seat to
face backwards, and standing on the peddles. After
the fight I saw 6 G's on the meter. Lost a lot of
weight in 1.5 hours on those flights! And I really
appreciate every day what our military does.

Kurt S.

Do not archive

--- Guy Buchanan <bnn(at)nethere.com> wrote:

Quote:
I did just that, except being a IV I
designed it for about 6x40 =
240lb at ultimate, (failure). I then tested it by
climbing in and jumping
up and down on it. (I weigh about 195, so needed
some G's.)
You definitely should be bothered by the
proximity of the control
rod. A failure of the baggage floor could ruin your
whole day.............


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smokey_bear_40220(at)yaho
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 03, 2006 8:34 pm    Post subject: Baggage compartment Reply with quote

Yes Dan,

I'd like to see how you did it. Mine is flying, but
never "done". It can always be made better.

Kurt S.

--- Dan Billingsley <dan(at)azshowersolutions.com> wrote:

Quote:
Kurt,
It may be a little tough if you already have your
bird covered, but have you thought of building a
floor in over the pushrod? Built with aluminum angle
and held in place with adel clamps. If interested I
can send a few pictures...contact off site.
Dan B
Mesa, AZ
www.azshowersolutions.com/Kitfox1.html


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bnn(at)nethere.com
Guest





PostPosted: Sat Mar 04, 2006 12:03 pm    Post subject: Baggage compartment Reply with quote

At 08:24 PM 3/3/2006, you wrote:
Quote:
As
for now, I keep it limited to 135 lbs and that loaded
forward because the elevator tube could rub.

Well, if you're uncomfortable sitting in your cargo area, I would think you
would be very uncomfortable with 135 pounds in it. (3.8g * 135 lbs = 513
lbs.) Unless you weigh more than 513 lbs... Wink

Quote:
You are right about wing strut ends too. Mine had to
have the upgraded bolts to use 1550# gross.

Which bolts did you upgrade? The outboard end? To what did you upgrade?

Quote:
I was flying
at full power, left hand on the stick upside down
(thumb down and elbow up) spun around in my seat to
face backwards, and standing on the peddles.

You were flying an A4 sitting BACKWARDS? You ARE good! (Not sure I'd try it
in a 152.)
Guy Buchanan
K-IV 1200 / 582 / 99.9% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.


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kingjohne(at)adelphia.net
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 04, 2006 6:45 pm    Post subject: Baggage compartment Reply with quote

Kirt,

I attached the plywood sides to the tubing with #6-32 stainless flat
head screws that were screwed into anchor nuts. The anchor nuts were
secured to small wood blocks that were cemented with structural adhesive
to the tubing. The plywood sides were attached to the floor by aluminum
angle and #6-32 SS screws. All plywood sides were removable. The
weight of the plywood and aluminum angles were a pound more than the
cloth sack provided by SkyStar. I did not use the cloth sack.

--
John King
Warrenton, VA
kurt schrader wrote:

Quote:


Thanks John,

Did you fasten the wood to the upper tubing with Adel
clemps, or what? Any other supports added? Did it
add much weight? I suppose it is removable. I'll do
an upgrade on that later on my plane.

Kurt S.

--- John King <kingjohne(at)adelphia.net> wrote:



>Kurt,
>
>That bothered me when I was building my Series 6.
>Also I did not like
>the fabric sides as a support to contain shifting
>cargo in turbulence.
>I decided to remove the fabric entirely and designed
>solid sides and a
>back end with removal 3/32-inch aircraft grade
>plywood. The plywood
>sides and bottom also supported the cargo deck. It
>turned into a much more sturdier cargo bay.
>
>--
>John King
>Warrenton, VA
>
>


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smokey_bear_40220(at)yaho
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 8:57 pm    Post subject: Baggage compartment Reply with quote

That is quite an upgrade for one pound John. You da'
man! Again!

Kurt S.

--- John King <kingjohne(at)adelphia.net> wrote:

Quote:
Kirt,

I attached the plywood sides to the tubing with
#6-32 stainless flat
head screws that were screwed into anchor nuts. The
anchor nuts were
secured to small wood blocks that were cemented with
structural adhesive
to the tubing. The plywood sides were attached to
the floor by aluminum
angle and #6-32 SS screws. All plywood sides were
removable. The
weight of the plywood and aluminum angles were a
pound more than the
cloth sack provided by SkyStar. I did not use the
cloth sack.

John King
Warrenton, VA


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smokey_bear_40220(at)yaho
Guest





PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 9:14 pm    Post subject: Baggage compartment Reply with quote

Guy,

--- Guy Buchanan <bnn(at)nethere.com> wrote:

Quote:
Well, if you're uncomfortable sitting in your cargo
area, I would think you
would be very uncomfortable with 135 pounds in it.
(3.8g * 135 lbs = 513
lbs.) Unless you weigh more than 513 lbs... Wink

Ya' caught me between diets Guy.... Wink Really it is
that first step in when all my weight is on one foot
that scares me. My footprint isn't the same as a
spread out load on that bulsa floor.

Quote:
-------------------------
>You are right about wing strut ends too. Mine had
>to have the upgraded bolts to use 1550# gross.

Which bolts did you upgrade? The outboard end? To
what did you upgrade?

The outboard ends. 1/4" bolts. Actually they were
upgraded to harder bolts by SkyStar on the later
S-5's, so I was told. I just used the ones provided.

Quote:
-------------------------

Quote:
>I was flying
>at full power, left hand on the stick upside down
>(thumb down and elbow up) spun around in my seat to
>face backwards, and standing on the peddles.

You were flying an A4 sitting BACKWARDS? You ARE
good! (Not sure I'd try it in a 152.)

"Used to" be good, Guy. Now just old and looking back
in time. Just as amazed as you are too. What is
really amazing is another pilot mooned his wingman in
one. Think of what that all requires. The cockpit
just isn't that big.

Kurt S.
Do not archive


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