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9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

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Dennis.Kirby(at)kirtland.
Guest

Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 2:43 pm Post subject: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

Classification:  UNCLASSIFIED  

 

  

Kolb Friends –  

   

I have a Sporty’s-200 handheld radio that I use occasionally in my Kolb.  Up to now, I have always operated it using its own battery power.  

   

Recently, I obtained a power cord to power the radio from an external DC source.  The cord plugs into the 12v DC cigar plug receptacle in my Mark-III, and the other end has a small plug jack that plugs into the radio.  I figure this will help save the batteries in the radio, if I power it from the aircraft 12v power system.  

   

Here’s my question: The plug jack on the radio says “9vDC” on it.  Nine volts?!  

The eight double-A batteries that make up the battery pack (at a volt and a half each) totals 12 volts, so it’s inconsistent why would the markings on the radio would say 9 volts.  

   

Will it hurt this radio to run 12v DC into it from the external plug-in power source?  (This individual circuit is fused at 3 amps.)  

   

Hoping to gain some knowledge before I fly it like this …  

   

Thanks –  

Dennis Kirby  

Mark-3, 912ul, “Magic Bike”  

Cedar Crest, NM  

      

Classification:  UNCLASSIFIED   

 

  [quote][b]

Ed in JXN

Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 122

Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 3:04 pm Post subject: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

Hi Dennis,

  

         I'd guess  Sporty's has the right adapter.  Don't wanna let the 'smoke' out!   Some electronics are tolerant of the overvoltage, others aren't.  Cell  phones in particular can have pretty sophisticated adapters, work on 12/24V as  an example.

  

 Ed in JXN

 MkII/503

 Do not archive.

 [quote]   ---

ulflyer(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 3:29 pm Post subject: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

Got an answer for your radio power supply - I believe it was Target used to sell a voltage regulator that plugged into a cigar lighter - it had a switch on it to set it to different output voltages commonly used by electronic devices.  A friend got his first then I got one for my plane to add protection for the radio.  It worked good.

 jerb  



 At 04:41 PM 1/21/2009, you wrote:

 [quote]Classification: UNCLASSIFIED 



 

 Kolb Friends –

  

 I have a Sporty’s-200 handheld radio that I use occasionally in my Kolb.  Up to now, I have always operated it using its own battery power.

  

 Recently, I obtained a power cord to power the radio from an external DC source.  The cord plugs into the 12v DC cigar plug receptacle in my Mark-III, and the other end has a small plug jack that plugs into the radio.  I figure this will help save the batteries in the radio, if I power it from the aircraft 12v power system.

  

 Here’s my question: The plug jack on the radio says “9vDC” on it.  Nine volts?!

 The eight double-A batteries that make up the battery pack (at a volt and a half each) totals 12 volts, so it’s inconsistent why would the markings on the radio would say 9 volts.

  

 Will it hurt this radio to run 12v DC into it from the external plug-in power source?  (This individual circuit is fused at 3 amps.)

  

 Hoping to gain some knowledge before I fly it like this …

  

 Thanks –

 Dennis Kirby

 Mark-3, 912ul, “Magic Bike”

 Cedar Crest, NM



 Classification: UNCLASSIFIED 

 



 

 [b]

mdnanwelch7(at)hotmail.co
Guest

Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 3:46 pm Post subject: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

Dennis, 

 

  Yes, you do run the chance of frying something.  99.9% of all AA rechargable batteries are actually 1.2 volts, not 1.5 volts like Duracells.  I don't know why they do that, it's dumb if you ask me.

  If you put a multimeter across the radio's battery pack, you see pretty close to;

8 batteries x 1.2v = 9.6 volts  (not 12v, like you're thinking)

 

  BTW, Radio Shack sells a variable voltage aux. power, that plugs into your cigarette plug hole.

It comes with a handful of interchangable plugs.  If I remember correctly, it offers 3v, 6v, 9v,& 12v.

 

  Yes, you can ruin something, even if you are only a fraction of a volt away from what's correct.  I plugged my 3.4 volt Nokia phone into a 3.6 volts supply.  Fried that sucker dead, dead, dead!  It became a paperweight real quick.  

 

  Last tip, I promise.  If anyone actually needs real, genuine, bonafide, full 1.5 volt NiMH rechargable batteries, you can get them on eBay somewhere.  Just do a 1.5 volt AA search. They're not those dopey 1.2 volt slugs, they ACT like Duracells!!  I got a couple dozen of them to run my digital camera.  That turkey eats batteries like the government had a bail-out offer on 'em.

 

Best regards,

Mike Welch



Subject: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio? 

Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 15:41:19 -0700

From: Dennis.Kirby(at)kirtland.af.mil

To: kolb-list(at)matronics.com



 

Kolb Friends –

 

I have a Sporty’s-200 handheld radio that I use occasionally in my Kolb.  Up to now, I have always operated it using its own battery power.

 

Recently, I obtained a power cord to power the radio from an external DC source.  The cord plugs into the 12v DC cigar plug receptacle in my Mark-III, and the other end has a small plug jack that plugs into the radio.  I figure this will help save the batteries in the radio, if I power it from the aircraft 12v power system.

 

Here’s my question: The plug jack on the radio says “9vDC” on it.  Nine volts?!

The eight double-A batteries that make up the battery pack (at a volt and a half each) totals 12 volts, so it’s inconsistent why would the markings on the radio would say 9 volts.

 

Will it hurt this radio to run 12v DC into it from the external plug-in power source?  (This individual circuit is fused at 3 amps.)

 

Hoping to gain some knowledge before I fly it like this …

 

Thanks –

Dennis Kirby

Mark-3, 912ul, “Magic Bike”

Cedar Crest, NM

 



_________________________________________________________________

Windows Live™ Hotmail®…more than just e-mail. 

http://windowslive.com/howitworks?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_t2_hm_justgotbetter_howitworks_012009

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 4:22 pm Post subject: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

Dennis:

  

 Here are the specs for power input for the  SP200:

  

  

Battery Pack Power 

Nicad Battery Pack 9.6 VDC / 600 mAH 

Alkaline Battery Pack 12.0 VDC (8 AA batteries x 1.5 VDC each) 

  

Nicad Bat is 9.6VDC and the Alky Bat  Pack is 12.0VDC.

 The way I interpret  that is the radio will operate on 12.0VDC or  9.6VDC.

  

 Most aviation radios  and other avionics have a pretty wide spread on operating  voltage.

  

 If it was my radio,  I'd operate it on 12VDC.  12VDC coming out of your on board aircraft  battery is the same as 12vdc coming out of 8 AA  bats.

  

 My Icom A3 is 12 to  15VDC.  18VDC will cause the LCD to flash 18VDC  Overvoltage.

  

 I'd contact  Sporty's.  Find out what voltage range is published for the SP200.  I  bet it is 9.6 to 12 VDC, or maybe 15VDC, but you will have to contact the  experts to verify.

  

 Sporty's has a multivoltage transformer for your  radio but they want $75.00 for it.

  

  

  

 john  h

 mkIII

 

 [quote]     

      

Will it hurt this radio to run 12v DC into it from the    external plug-in power source?  (This individual circuit is fused at 3    amps.)   

    

Hoping to gain some knowledge before I fly it like this    …   

    

Thanks –   

Dennis Kirby   

 

[b]

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

NeilsenRM(at)comcast.net
Guest

Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 4:30 pm Post subject: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

Dennis/All

  

 I don't know about the 9V - 12V issue but be very  careful to unplug your equipment while cranking or powering off your airplane. I  have a King KLX100 that I have fried twice by cranking or turning off the  ignition while the radio is plugged into the system. Both times King fixed the  power circuit for a nominal charge but now they talk about a major  charge.

  

 Most cars have circuit that interrupts power to  radios while cranking. Wish my plane does. 

  

 Rick Neilsen

 Redrive VW powered MKIIIC

  

 [quote]   ---

Rick Lewis

Joined: 03 Jul 2007
Posts: 122
Location: Kingston, Tn.

Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 6:39 pm Post subject: Re: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

Ricks right on the cranking of the engine with electronics on.  The transient voltages spikes from the starter motor can be several hundred volts, bad news for radio's.  Your hand held radio probably has a built in voltage regulator.  But be sure to check your manual or Sporty's  to verify this before trying it.



Rick Lewis

aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 6:43 pm Post subject: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

Dennis,

From the JD-200 manual:

Cigarette Lighter Power Adapter/Nicad Battery Charger (#8634A)

Allows the JD-200 to be powered externally from a cigarette lighter in aircraft with 12,

 24 or 28 Volt electrical systems (accepts input voltage of 10 to 30 Volts DC). Plugs into

 the side of the JD-200, which allows the unit to be powered with or without a battery

pack attached. Also charges the optional Nicad Battery Pack (#8631A). Safe for use

with the Alkaline Battery Pack. Power cord measures 6 ft. long.

 Note: Bold print done by me.

If you have this adapter you can carefully open it up and look inside. I'll bet you a quarter that all you'll find is a small resistor and an LED. Thats all there was in the adapter for my Lowrance 2000 GPS and my Icom radio. All voltage regulation is done internally to the device not in the adapter. Give Sporty's a call and I'll bet they tell you the same thing. 

 It's a liability issue for the manufacturer. They're selling you a backup radio and the legal bills would just sky rocket if an adapter fried your radio when you needed it in an emergency.

If Sporty's tells you it is as I think, you can save some money and panel space by foregoing the cigarette lighter socket. Find any old charger for any appliance that has the right diameter and length of plug that goes in the side of the radio. These can be found at DAV, Goodwill, etc for fifty cents to a dollar. Cut the transformer off and wire it up through a fuse directly into the airplane. 

 Just make sure you know: 



The polarity of the socket
Which wire goes to which part of the plugRick

Rick



On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 4:41 PM, Kirby, Dennis CTR USAF AFMC MDA/AL <Dennis.Kirby(at)kirtland.af.mil (Dennis.Kirby(at)kirtland.af.mil)> wrote:

  	  Quote: 	
		                 

Classification:  UNCLASSIFIED  

 

  

Kolb Friends –  

   

I have a Sporty's-200 handheld radio that I use occasionally in my Kolb.  Up to now, I have always operated it using its own battery power.  

   

Recently, I obtained a power cord to power the radio from an external DC source.  The cord plugs into the 12v DC cigar plug receptacle in my Mark-III, and the other end has a small plug jack that plugs into the radio.  I figure this will help save the batteries in the radio, if I power it from the aircraft 12v power system.  

   

Here's my question: The plug jack on the radio says "9vDC" on it.  Nine volts?!  

The eight double-A batteries that make up the battery pack (at a volt and a half each) totals 12 volts, so it's inconsistent why would the markings on the radio would say 9 volts.  

   

Will it hurt this radio to run 12v DC into it from the external plug-in power source?  (This individual circuit is fused at 3 amps.)  

   

Hoping to gain some knowledge before I fly it like this …  

   

Thanks –  

Dennis Kirby  

Mark-3, 912ul, "Magic Bike"  

Cedar Crest, NM  



      

Classification:  UNCLASSIFIED   

 

  ==== get="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List tp://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution  [/b] 	


[b]

by0ung(at)brigham.net
Guest

Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 9:49 pm Post subject: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

If it was my radio, I'd operate it on 12VDC.  12VDC coming out of your on board aircraft battery is the same as 12vdc coming out of 8 AA bats.  

   

   

 	  Quote: 	
		  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>   

   
	


12 v is 12 v,,,,,  however on my 912 the charging system runs at 13.8 v-----------  call sporty and see what they recommend.  

   

   

Boyd.    

       [quote][b]

by0ung(at)brigham.net
Guest

Posted: Wed Jan 21, 2009 9:58 pm Post subject: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

Most cars have circuit that interrupts power to radios while cranking. Wish my plane does.   

   

Rick Neilsen  

Redrive VW powered MKIIIC  

   

 	  Quote: 	
		  >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.  

   
	


Rick,     my main switch for my radio’s etc,,,,  is a     double throw     on off on    switch  

   

My starter switch does not get power until the radio’s etc are off.  

   

Boyd   

       [quote][b]

Dana

Joined: 13 Dec 2007
Posts: 1047
Location: Connecticut, USA

Posted: Thu Jan 22, 2009 4:17 am Post subject: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

If the receptacle on the radio says 9V, I wouldn't run it on any more 

without checking with the manufacturer first.  Just because the alkaline 

battery pack provides 12V doesn't mean that the battery power isn't 

regulated internally down to 9V... in fact that makes sense, since a NiMH 

battery pack only provides 9.6V, it would be logical to regulate power from 

either battery down to 9V to run the radio.  The external power supply may 

bypass the regulator, if they're expecting to already be 9V.  The 12V power 

adapter that Sporty's sells for that radio may include a 9V regulator.



The 9V limitation may also be to prevent any attempt to recharge the 12V 

alkaline battery pack.



Remember, too, that most "12V" electrical systems in aircraft and cars 

actually produce 13-14V.



FWIW, the power receptacle on my Icom radio is labeled "11V".  It may just 

be an attempt to intimidate people into buying the [expensive] adapter from 

Icom instead of the generic 12V one, or it may be a real limitation... I 

haven't investigated yet since I don't have 12V power on my plane.



-Dana

--

  The missionaries go forth to Christianize the savages-- as if the savages 

weren't dangerous enough already.

zeprep251(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Thu Jan 22, 2009 4:59 am Post subject: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

Ran an Icom A-5 in a Firestar with no battery in the plane but with a regulator, shunted to ground thru a 3200 mf condenser,showing 14.2 volts on the EIS, for 7 years.That radio is now in the MK-3.So far so good.

 

   

 

   

 

 --

John Hauck

Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 4639
Location: Titus, Alabama (hauck's holler)

Posted: Thu Jan 22, 2009 7:34 am Post subject: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

> FWIW, the power receptacle on my Icom radio is labeled "11V".  It may 

just

 	  Quote: 	
		   be an attempt to intimidate people into buying the [expensive] adapter 

 from Icom instead of the generic 12V one, or it may be a real 

 limitation... I haven't investigated yet since I don't have 12V power on 

 my plane.



 -Dana


	


Dana:



My radio is in the airplane.  I don't know what it says on the power socket, 

but I have been operating it for quite some time now on onboard power alone. 

I leave the battery pack at home.  I'll take a look, if I can remember, next 

time I go to the airstrip.  I bet it also says 11VDC.



My radio is a ICOM A3, smallest cheapest good quality hand held I could 

find.  I have flown all over Alaska, Canada, and CONUS with this radio.  It 

and my Garmin 196 GPS are the extent of my avionics package.  Keep it 

simple.



john h

mkIII

_________________
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler
Titus, Alabama

jbhart(at)onlyinternet.ne
Guest

Posted: Thu Jan 22, 2009 9:55 am Post subject: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

At 06:39 PM 1/21/09 -0800, you wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		  



Ricks right on the cranking of the engine with electronics on.  The transient voltages spikes from the starter motor can be several hundred volts, bad news for radio's.  Your hand held radio probably has a built in voltage regulator.  But be sure to check your manual or Sporty's  to verify this before trying it.




	


Rick,



On my FireFly, I run my gps and radio off of power converters that plug into 

the engine/battery  electrical system.  I worried about not turning off the 

radio after a flight and running the battery down.  To prevent this I feed 

the power from the regulator to the battery with a blocking diode.  And then 

I take power from the regulator side of the diode for the radio and gps.  

The disadvantage of this is that there is no power for radio or gps until 

the engine is running.  But if the radio and gps internal batteries are up 

this is not a problem.  This same blocking diode prevents starter high 

voltage pikes from entering the radio and gps power system.



Currently, I do not have a problem with leaving the radio and gps powered 

up.  I remounted the whole works into a vest with leg attachments.  Every 

time I get out of the FireFly, I have to unplug from the plane power circuit.  



Jack B. Hart FF004

Winchester, IN

Dana

Joined: 13 Dec 2007
Posts: 1047
Location: Connecticut, USA

Posted: Thu Jan 22, 2009 9:55 am Post subject: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

At 10:33 AM 1/22/2009, John Hauck wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  Dana:



My radio is in the airplane.  I don't know what it says on the power 

socket, but I have been operating it for quite some time now on onboard 

power alone. I leave the battery pack at home.  I'll take a look, if I can 

remember, next time I go to the airstrip.  I bet it also says 11VDC.



My radio is a ICOM A3, smallest cheapest good quality hand held I could 

find.  I have flown all over Alaska, Canada, and CONUS with this 

radio.  It and my Garmin 196 GPS are the extent of my avionics 

package.  Keep it simple.


	


Mine's the A24, dunno if the voltage requirements are the same.  Once I get 

my new GPS mounted (Garmin 60CSx, not an aviation model but I'm working on 

putting aeronautical data on it) I'll start looking at powering both from 

the plane; the Cuyuna has the lighting coil but (as yet) no regulator.



-Dana



--

  Duelling is legal in Paraguay as long as both parties are registered 

blood donors.

icrashrc

Joined: 16 Mar 2006
Posts: 247
Location: Mishawaka, In

Posted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 10:24 am Post subject: Re: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

To all, 

I'm going to answer a number of questions in one post. I've been watching this thread but haven't had time to respond. I still don't really have the time so i'm making it easy on me. Sorry.

Dennis K.,

The short answer is your best bet is to call Sportys and ask.



Now for the long version...

I bought a new iCom A-24 (at) S-n-F last year. When i got back to the hotel room i did what any modern gadget junkie would do. I plugged it in to start charging with the included 110v power supply. Then i turned it on and opened the instruction manual. It turns out your not supposed to power up the radio while it's charging. Never mind the fact that in iComs own product brochure it says it's OK to do what i did.

[http://www.icomamerica.com/en/products/avionics/handheld/a24/default.aspx]

I now have a over voltage message that comes on every time i power up the radio.  I talked to the iCom rep at Oshkosh and he told me too bad, i should have read the instructions packed with the radio before touching the radio. He also told me there's no way to make the over voltage message go away and that i should use it as a reminder of my foolishness. I told him all it would do would be to remind me never to buy an iCom radio again. The bottom line is iCom doesn't seem to be able to add a charge control circuit to a $400 radio but any Chinese sweatshop can add one to a $10 toy.



Mike,



Battery cell voltage is based on the chemistry of the cell. Nickle based cells are 1.2 volts because that's what the chemistry creates. There are no 1.5 volt nickle based cells. Only confused retailers. 



Most wall wart type power supplies are unregulated so it's no surprise you toasted your Nokia phone. The only real surprise is it didn't ignite the battery. Lithium based cells do not tolerate over voltage well!



John H. is correct in that some of the hand held radios on the market are sold with either a rechargeable pack or a dry cell pack. These radios should operate safely on either but not necessarily on the 14+ volts of a properly operating airplane or car charging system.



Rick N.,

A severe voltage spike problem usually means there's an issue somewhere else. Generally on the ground side of the circuit. If all your power connections are correct and you don't have a ground loop setup anywhere then your best bet is to put a large capacitor in the power feed for your avionics. That will help absorb the spike and protect your valuable equipment. 

There is an issue with certain unprotected starter solenoids. If there's not a internal diode on your solenoid you need to add one externally. The collapse of the magnetic field in the solenoid can cause a substantial reverse voltage spike. 



Feel free to email me direct if I've caused more questions then I've answered.

_________________
Scott

www.ill-EagleAviation.com

do not archive

mdnanwelch7(at)hotmail.co
Guest

Posted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 11:18 am Post subject: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

Scott,

 

  You are correct, there are NO NiMH 1.5 volt AA batteries.  I misspoke.  I didn't actually read the chemical contents of them when I made reference to them.  Being that they are rechargable, I 

assumed they were NiMHs.

 

  They are actually 1.5 volt AA Rechargeable Alkalines.  I put my digital Multimeter to a fully charged one, and it says "1.585 volts".  Good batteries.

 

  I bought the AA rechargeable battery shell ($38..eecks!) for my Icom A24.  It's just the container, you add your own batteries.

 

  Thanks for the correction.

 

Mike Welch

MKIII

_________________________________________________________________

Hotmail® goes where you go. On a PC, on the Web, on your phone. 

http://www.windowslive-hotmail.com/learnmore/versatility.aspx#mobile?ocid=TXT_TAGHM_WL_HM_versatility_121208

Dana

Joined: 13 Dec 2007
Posts: 1047
Location: Connecticut, USA

Posted: Fri Jan 23, 2009 3:20 pm Post subject: 9-volt DC Power for a Handheld Radio?

At 01:24 PM 1/23/2009, icrashrc wrote:



 	  Quote: 	
		  I bought a new iCom A-24 (at) S-n-F last year. When i got back to the hotel 

room i did what any modern gadget junkie would do. I plugged it in to 

start charging with the included 110v power supply. Then i turned it on 

and opened the instruction manual. It turns out your not supposed to power 

up the radio while it's charging. Never mind the fact that in iComs own 

product brochure it says it's OK to do what i did.

[http://www.icomamerica.com/en/products/avionics/handheld/a24/default.aspx]

I now have a over voltage message that comes on every time i power up the 

radio.  I talked to the iCom rep at Oshkosh and he told me too bad, i 

should have read the instructions packed with the radio before touching 

the radio. He also told me there's no way to make the over voltage message 

go away...


	


Hmmm, I'm not sure but I'm pretty sure I've used the radio while plugged in 

to the AC adapter.  Could be wrong though.  That might explain why the AC 

battery charger is 12V but the radio is labeled 11V... 12V for charging, 

11V for external power?



I would bitch and moan at Icom until they reflashed the BIOS under 

warranty, I'm sure that would get rid of the message.



-Dana



--

  PADDLE FASTER!! I hear banjo music!!

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