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brake drag

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Charles Heathco

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 201

Posted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 3:41 pm Post subject: brake drag

I searched arcives and cant find specific procedure  to pull the puck and change the o ring, other that a mention of using viton  o-rings and high temp fluid. I also found my post of same question 3 yers ago,  one answer that only said check free movment on pins. main concern is keeping  fluitd from all running out and does spruce have the viton orings? Charlie  H/ 

   [quote][b]

recapen(at)earthlink.net
Guest

Posted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 3:53 pm Post subject: brake drag

Charlie,

  

 I couldn't get them from spruce when I got them -  so I got a bunch.  If you can't find a pair, let me know - we'll work  something out.

 Meanwhile, I'll try to remember where I got  mine......

  

 Ralph

 [quote]   ---

Kellym

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1705
Location: Sun Lakes AZ

Posted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 3:54 pm Post subject: brake drag

Take compressed air blow gun, and apply very loosely to brake line 

fitting, to blow the cylinder out of the caliper. All cautions about 

having rag to catch it and very low pressure to prevent damage/injury.



charlie heathco wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   I searched arcives and cant find specific procedure to pull the puck and 

 change the o ring, other that a mention of using viton o-rings and high 

 temp fluid. I also found my post of same question 3 yers ago, one answer 

 that only said check free movment on pins. main concern is keeping 

 fluitd from all running out and does spruce have the viton 

 orings? Charlie H/

 

 *

 

 

 *

_________________
Kelly McMullen
A&P/IA, EAA Tech Counselor # 5286
KCHD

recapen(at)earthlink.net
Guest

Posted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 4:11 pm Post subject: brake drag

Maybe I can answer the question as it was asked -  now that I read the entire passage.

  

 I changed mine over prior to filling them with  fluid in the first place.  All I did was blow a little compressed air in  and it popped out right in my hand as I was holding the assembly together.   It was a little messy with the assembly fliud - but manageable.

  

 HTH,

 Ralph

 [quote]   ---

Tailgummer(at)aol.com
Guest

Posted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 7:02 pm Post subject: brake drag

From  Randy Lervold's site:

  

 Standard  MS replacement O-rings areMS28775-218;  2-218V-75  are the Viton O-rings. Try Ace Seal: http://www.aceseal.com.

  

    The High temp fluid is: .  MIL-H-83282. Google Royco 782 or Aeroshell 31.

   John D

  In a message dated 8/16/2009 4:42:52 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,  cheathco(at)cox.net writes:

  	  Quote: 	
		     I searched arcives and cant find specific    procedure to pull the puck and change the o ring, other that a mention of    using viton o-rings and high temp fluid. I also found my post of same question    3 yers ago, one answer that only said check free movment on pins. main concern    is keeping fluitd from all running out and does spruce have the viton    orings? Charlie H/ 

 	  Quote: 	
		  



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====================================

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====================================

tp://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution

====================================



	
	


  [quote][b]

recapen(at)earthlink.net
Guest

Posted: Sun Aug 16, 2009 7:39 pm Post subject: brake drag

These were my vendors too!  Thanks for the reminder....

 [quote]   ---

rv9jim(at)juno.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 5:07 am Post subject: brake drag

Charlie,

        I have a small industrial supply shop and I sell O-Rings. 

Needless to say, I installed my brakes with Viton.  I also, used the high

temp fluid.  I feel more comfortable, if I get into a situation where I

have to really get on the brakes, not have them over heat.  I believe the

O-Rings is a #243 but its been several years so a double check on the

part number. The archives have the part number.  I also put a small

spring on the master cylinders to be sure that the system would fully

retract when using the brakes.  No drag with this system.

Jim

____________________________________________________________

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Charles Heathco

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 201

Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 10:45 am Post subject: brake drag

Jim. I found your post re the viton, was couple years ago t I hink, then 

when I went to write down the part #, I hit a wrong key and lost that post, 

could not find it again. That was Sunday. Seems you said something about 

pluging the line to keep fluid from running out, but How did you do that? 

Charlie. BTW, you have a couple extr viton ?

---

rv9jim(at)juno.com
Guest

Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 1:06 pm Post subject: brake drag

Hi Charlie,

        If your system has fluid in it, there is no way you can change

the wheel puck O-Rings with out getting air into the system.  (well there

is one way)  At this juncture, I would get a AN plug for that line size. 

That way when you loosen the line from the brake cyl, you can keep a

large amount (actually a very small amount of fluid)  from draining down

and out of the system.  I would then, remove the wheel CYL and replace

the O-Rings.  Then, replace the wheel cyl and fill the assy with fluid

until it comes out of the fitting that attaches to the brake line.  IF

you are quick, and have someone inside that can apply pressure when you

remove the AN plug, you could reconnect the line and not get any air into

the system.  Can be done.  If you find any softness, then you need to

bleed the system on the side that seems to be soft.  I have found that

using a large syringe filled with brake fluid and a small PVC hose from

HD or Lows you can add fluid back into the system and run the bubbles

out.  Hint, when adding pressure when reattaching the brake CYL, do it

with just enough pressure to force fluid out of the line as the AN

fitting comes off.  Quickly reattaching the line will get it done with

out air.  With all the air out of the wheel CYL, it should work fine.  I

always have a lot of paper towels on hand especially to cover the brake

assy. from getting fluid on the disk etc.  Just some thoughts that may

help you.

Jim

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Charles Heathco

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 201

Posted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 6:07 pm Post subject: brake drag

Thanks Jim, the info has been very helpful, Ill have to get ahold of the 

viton, I will hae to go back and check, I beleive Ralph Capen emailed the 

viton part # yesterday. or someone if mem serves (desnt serve like it used 

to  )

---

gmcjetpilot

Joined: 04 Nov 2006
Posts: 170

Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 3:16 am Post subject: brake drag

Service the Brakes,

 

 

 

Replace the Break Pads***

 

Clean and lube moving parts (brake pad plates pins removed corrosion)**

 

(be careful keep lube off of disk and pads clean)

 

Bleed carefully with help bottom up top down

 

Might as well replace bearings

 

Might as well rotate tires*

 

 

 

* (Remove tire from rims, re-install on opposite rim balance)

 

 

 

** (Consider an overhaul of caliper disassemble, inspect, new O-ring, corrosion in the piston bore can cause breaks to stick, moisture can get into the cylinder on the outer side of the O-ring and cause corrosion.)

 

 

 

*** When the pads get worn, even look like they have life this will cause brakes to stick. The caliper piston has to extend further and it can get cocked ever so slightly, since so little is engaged with in the caliper body. This causes it to stick extended, even lock.

 

 

 

Inspect Inspect Inspect, clean, service, remove and replace anything that is not perfect.

 

 

 

That should solve your problems

 

 

 

Cheers George



          [quote][b]

pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.
Guest

Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 6:07 am Post subject: brake drag

gmcjetpilot(at)yahoo.com wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   Service the Brakes,

 

  

 

 Replace the Break Pads***

 

 Clean and lube moving parts (brake pad plates pins removed corrosion)**

Not sure what this meant .... but do not lube the pins.  They're 
	


designed to work dry.  Almost any lube will attract dirt and really gum 

up the works.

Linn

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 (be careful keep lube off of disk and pads clean)

 

 Bleed carefully with help bottom up top down

 

 Might as well replace bearings

 

 Might as well rotate tires*

 

  

 

 * (Remove tire from rims, re-install on opposite rim balance)

 

  

 

 ** (Consider an overhaul of caliper disassemble, inspect, new O-ring, 

 corrosion in the piston bore can cause breaks to stick, moisture can get 

 into the cylinder on the outer side of the O-ring and cause corrosion.)

 

  

 

 *** When the pads get worn, even look like they have life this will 

 cause brakes to stick. The caliper piston has to extend further and it 

 can get cocked ever so slightly, since so little is engaged with in the 

 caliper body. This causes it to stick extended, even lock.

 

  

 

 Inspect Inspect Inspect, clean, service, remove and replace anything 

 that is not perfect.

 

  

 

 That should solve your problems

 

  

 

 Cheers George

 

 

 *

 

 

 *

Kellym

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1705
Location: Sun Lakes AZ

Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 8:51 am Post subject: brake drag

Not true. Caliper pins should be lubed with silicone grease intended for 

disk brakes. Dry they will wear.

Linn Walters wrote:

 	  Quote: 	

 gmcjetpilot(at)yahoo.com wrote:

> Service the Brakes,

>

>  

>

> Replace the Break Pads***

>

> Clean and lube moving parts (brake pad plates pins removed corrosion)**

 Not sure what this meant .... but do not lube the pins.  They're 

 designed to work dry.  Almost any lube will attract dirt and really gum 

 up the works.

 Linn

_________________
Kelly McMullen
A&P/IA, EAA Tech Counselor # 5286
KCHD

pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.
Guest

Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 9:10 am Post subject: brake drag

Could you point me to the instructions that say to do that???

Linn

Kelly McMullen wrote:

 	  Quote: 	

 Not true. Caliper pins should be lubed with silicone grease intended for 

 disk brakes. Dry they will wear.

 Linn Walters wrote:

> 

>

> gmcjetpilot(at)yahoo.com wrote:

>> Service the Brakes,

>>

>>  

>>

>> Replace the Break Pads***

>>

>> Clean and lube moving parts (brake pad plates pins removed corrosion)**

> Not sure what this meant .... but do not lube the pins.  They're 

> designed to work dry.  Almost any lube will attract dirt and really 

> gum up the works.

> Linn

Kellym

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1705
Location: Sun Lakes AZ

Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 1:10 pm Post subject: brake drag

http://members.eaa.org/home/homebuilders/building/landing/1Your%20Brake%20Installation.html?

Is one location. Look near the bottom of the article regarding anchor pins.



Linn Walters wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 Could you point me to the instructions that say to do that???

 Linn

 

 Kelly McMullen wrote:

> 

>

> Not true. Caliper pins should be lubed with silicone grease intended 

> for disk brakes. Dry they will wear.

>

> Linn Walters wrote:

>> 

>>

>> gmcjetpilot(at)yahoo.com wrote:

>>> Service the Brakes,

>>>

>>>  

>>>

>>> Replace the Break Pads***

>>>

>>> Clean and lube moving parts (brake pad plates pins removed corrosion)**

>> Not sure what this meant .... but do not lube the pins.  They're 

>> designed to work dry.  Almost any lube will attract dirt and really 

>> gum up the works.

>> Linn

>

_________________
Kelly McMullen
A&P/IA, EAA Tech Counselor # 5286
KCHD

pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.
Guest

Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 2:03 pm Post subject: brake drag

OK, I can accept that.  For most of us 'lube' means grease.  The 

important word is 'dry', and here is what they said:

Keep the anchor bolts free of rust and lubricate them with a dry 

lubricant spray like G. E. Silicone or graphite. Don't use your old 

favorite WD-40, or any kind of wet grease as they will only attract dirt 

and compound the wear.



I was taught to clean any dirt, rust etc, and reassemble dry.  Never 

seen any pins assembled that way 'wear out' except where something else 

failed.

Linn

Kelly McMullen wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 http://members.eaa.org/home/homebuilders/building/landing/1Your%20Brake%20Installation.html? 

 

 Is one location. Look near the bottom of the article regarding anchor pins.

 

 Linn Walters wrote:

> 

>

> Could you point me to the instructions that say to do that???

> Linn

>

> Kelly McMullen wrote:

>> 

>>

>> Not true. Caliper pins should be lubed with silicone grease intended 

>> for disk brakes. Dry they will wear.

>>

>> Linn Walters wrote:

>>> 

>>>

>>> gmcjetpilot(at)yahoo.com wrote:

>>>> Service the Brakes,

>>>>

>>>>  

>>>>

>>>> Replace the Break Pads***

>>>>

>>>> Clean and lube moving parts (brake pad plates pins removed 

>>>> corrosion)**

>>> Not sure what this meant .... but do not lube the pins.  They're 

>>> designed to work dry.  Almost any lube will attract dirt and really 

>>> gum up the works.

>>> Linn

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>

Kellym

Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 1705
Location: Sun Lakes AZ

Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 2:11 pm Post subject: brake drag

All the higher time brakes I inspect show wear, which comes from 

combination of rust and lack of lube. While silicone spray will work, 

IMHO it is inadequate to last from one annual to the next. A grease like 

DC-4 or other silicone grease accomplishes the same thing, with much 

more staying power and will reduce chance of rust.

Your modern cars all use floating calipers, just like your standard 

Cleveland calipers, and they all specify the same silicone grease, and 

often supply it with replacement pads or hardware kits. If the anchor 

pins are dry, they will get mud from splash drying on them and that will 

promote both rust and wear. Spray silicone does little to protect 

against that. Graphite is not good around aluminum and magnesium.

But, you are experimental, and you can experiment all you want.



Linn Walters wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 

 OK, I can accept that.  For most of us 'lube' means grease.  The 

 important word is 'dry', and here is what they said:

 Keep the anchor bolts free of rust and lubricate them with a dry 

 lubricant spray like G. E. Silicone or graphite. Don't use your old 

 favorite WD-40, or any kind of wet grease as they will only attract dirt 

 and compound the wear.

 

 I was taught to clean any dirt, rust etc, and reassemble dry.  Never 

 seen any pins assembled that way 'wear out' except where something else 

 failed.

 Linn

 

 

 Kelly McMullen wrote:

> 

>

> http://members.eaa.org/home/homebuilders/building/landing/1Your%20Brake%20Installation.html? 

>

> Is one location. Look near the bottom of the article regarding anchor 

> pins.

>

> Linn Walters wrote:

>> 

>>

>> Could you point me to the instructions that say to do that???

>> Linn

>>

>> Kelly McMullen wrote:

>>> 

>>>

>>> Not true. Caliper pins should be lubed with silicone grease intended 

>>> for disk brakes. Dry they will wear.

>>>

>>> Linn Walters wrote:

>>>> 

>>>> <pitts_pilot(at)bellsouth.net>

>>>>

>>>> gmcjetpilot(at)yahoo.com wrote:

>>>>> Service the Brakes,

>>>>>

>>>>>  

>>>>>

>>>>> Replace the Break Pads***

>>>>>

>>>>> Clean and lube moving parts (brake pad plates pins removed 

>>>>> corrosion)**

>>>> Not sure what this meant .... but do not lube the pins.  They're 

>>>> designed to work dry.  Almost any lube will attract dirt and really 

>>>> gum up the works.

>>>> Linn

>>>

>>>

>>>

>>>

>>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>

>

_________________
Kelly McMullen
A&P/IA, EAA Tech Counselor # 5286
KCHD

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