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Bill Strahan
Joined: 20 Aug 2008
Posts: 145
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 Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:39 am Post subject: Modified long wing tips |
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I saw a picture, I think it may have been from Sun n Fun, of a Lightning that had cut-down long wingtips.
I'm interested in making similar tips for my Lightning, and would appreciate it if an owner of a Lightning with these tips would offer some insight as to the process.
Pictures are worth a thousand words, so they would be helpful and require you to type a lot less!
Thanks,
Bill
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Kayberg(at)aol.com
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| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 3:54 am Post subject: Modified long wing tips |
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In a message dated 11/11/2009 3:40:00 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, bill(at)gdsx.com writes:
| Quote: | --> Lightning-List message posted by: "Bill Strahan" <bill(at)gdsx.com>
I saw a picture, I think it may have been from Sun n Fun, of a Lightning that had cut-down long wingtips.
I'm interested in making similar tips for my Lightning, and would appreciate it if an owner of a Lightning with these tips would offer some insight as to the process.
Pictures are worth a thousand words, so they would be helpful and require you to type a lot less!
Thanks,
Bill
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Bill, you probably saw one that was from the Green Landings build center.
While Ryan has developed some methods of doing the cut-down, it is just a "butcher and fill" job that takes many hours to do. You have to hack them apart and epoxy back together. No special tricks. It is critical to get the alignment and washout right, tho
It is my observation that build centers develop proprietary techniques that offer incentives to use their facilities. Consequently, they dont tend to disclose their "tricks" . In this case there is not much of a trick. Just annoying work.
Doug Koenigsberg
[quote][b]
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checkpoint2(at)comcast.ne
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| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 10:55 am Post subject: Modified long wing tips |
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The Lightning in question N330BH, is mine. The workmanship is very good, there is only
one seam that can be seen if you know where to look. Bob Haas.
From: owner-lightning-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-lightning-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kayberg(at)aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 11, 2009 6:52 AM
To: lightning-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: Lightning-List: Modified long wing tips
In a message dated 11/11/2009 3:40:00 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, bill(at)gdsx.com writes:
| Quote: |
--> Lightning-List message posted by: "Bill Strahan" <bill(at)gdsx.com>
I saw a picture, I think it may have been from Sun n Fun, of a Lightning that had cut-down long wingtips.
I'm interested in making similar tips for my Lightning, and would appreciate it if an owner of a Lightning with these tips would offer some insight as to the process.
Pictures are worth a thousand words, so they would be helpful and require you to type a lot less!
Thanks,
Bill |
Bill, you probably saw one that was from the Green Landings build center.
While Ryan has developed some methods of doing the cut-down, it is just a "butcher and fill" job that takes many hours to do. You have to hack them apart and epoxy back together. No special tricks. It is critical to get the alignment and washout right, tho
It is my observation that build centers develop proprietary techniques that offer incentives to use their facilities. Consequently, they dont tend to disclose their "tricks" . In this case there is not much of a trick. Just annoying work.
Doug Koenigsberg
| Quote: | | www.aeroelectric.com |
0123456789012345678
No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 270.14.60/2496 - Release Date: 11/11/09 07:40:00 [quote][b]
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sttwig
Joined: 26 Aug 2007
Posts: 31
Location: Yakima, WA
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| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 11:53 am Post subject: Modified long wing tips |
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That was done by Green Landings. I inquired about the process and didn't get a response. You might have better luck.
Steve Sundquist
Kit #48
On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 12:39 AM, Bill Strahan <bill(at)gdsx.com (bill(at)gdsx.com)> wrote:
[quote]--> Lightning-List message posted by: "Bill Strahan" <bill(at)gdsx.com (bill(at)gdsx.com)>
I saw a picture, I think it may have been from Sun n Fun, of a Lightning that had cut-down long wingtips.
I'm interested in making similar tips for my Lightning, and would appreciate it if an owner of a Lightning with these tips would offer some insight as to the process.
Pictures are worth a thousand words, so they would be helpful and require you to type a lot less!
Thanks,
Bill
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272287#272287
-= * AeroElectric www.aeroelectric.com
omebuiltHELP www.homebuilthelp.com
http:/r generous support!
Matronics List Features Navigator to browse
s.com/Navigator?Lightning-List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Lightning-List
ronics.com/" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
==============
[b]
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nylowinc(at)mac.com
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:12 pm Post subject: Modified long wing tips |
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Hey, anybody out there that has a FINISHED Lightning for sale?
Need a good-faster LSA than is on the market. Due to a minor medical fear that our dear FED will cancel my certificate I am going LSA and just put my Bonanza up for sale. Not too good at working on "things" so the request for a done plane.
Haven`t flown in one..but saw one about a year ago at CGZ during a fly in and was very impressed.
Thanks,
Hal
nylowinc(at)mac.com (nylowinc(at)mac.com)
On Nov 11, 2009, at 11:30 AM, Steven Sundquist wrote:
| Quote: | That was done by Green Landings. I inquired about the process and didn't get a response. You might have better luck.
Steve Sundquist
Kit #48
On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 12:39 AM, Bill Strahan <bill(at)gdsx.com (bill(at)gdsx.com)> wrote:
| Quote: | --> Lightning-List message posted by: "Bill Strahan" <bill(at)gdsx.com (bill(at)gdsx.com)>
I saw a picture, I think it may have been from Sun n Fun, of a Lightning that had cut-down long wingtips.
I'm interested in making similar tips for my Lightning, and would appreciate it if an owner of a Lightning with these tips would offer some insight as to the process.
Pictures are worth a thousand words, so they would be helpful and require you to type a lot less!
Thanks,
Bill
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=272287#272287
-= * AeroElectric www.aeroelectric.com
omebuiltHELP www.homebuilthelp.com
http:/r generous support!
Matronics List Features Navigator to browse
s.com/Navigator?Lightning-List" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Lightning-List
ronics.com/" target="_blank">http://forums.matronics.com
==============
href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com
href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com
href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Lightning-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Lightning-List
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
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marvinlnaz(at)yahoo.com
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| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:29 pm Post subject: Modified long wing tips |
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Hal,
I believe this one is still available on Barnstormers.com...
2008 LIGHTNING • $85,000 • CHECK THIS OUT • Jabiru 3300, 120 hp, Grand Rapids EFIS & EIS, TruTrak DigiFlight II 2 axis Auto Pilot, Garmin SL30, Garmin GTX327 xponder, PS Eng. intercom, AvMap EKP 4 GPS linked to EFIS & AP, electric trim & flaps, LED wing tip strobes/nav lights, dual boarding steps and extended wing tips. Excellent workmanship. Can be flown by Sport Pilots. Will trade for IFR Archer. Please call Gary 520-850-7527 • Contact Gary W. Pennington, Owner - located Tucson, AZ USA • Telephone: 520-850-7527 • Posted October 18, 2009 • Show all Ads posted by this Advertiser • Recommend This Ad to a Friend • Email Advertiser • Save to Watchlist • Report This Ad • View Larger Pictures 
    From: Hal Wolyn <nylowinc(at)mac.com>
To: lightning-list(at)matronics.com
Sent: Wed, November 11, 2009 1:06:44 PM
Subject: Re: Modified long wing tips
Hey, anybody out there that has a FINISHED Lightning for sale?
Need a good-faster LSA than is on the market. Due to a minor medical fear that our dear FED will cancel my certificate I am going LSA and just put my Bonanza up for sale. Not too good at working on "things" so the request for a done plane.
Haven`t flown in one..but saw one about a year ago at CGZ during a fly in and was very impressed.
Thanks,
Hal
nylowinc(at)mac.com (nylowinc(at)mac.com)
On Nov 11, 2009, at 11:30 AM, Steven Sundquist wrote:
| Quote: | That was done by Green Landings. I inquired about the process and didn't get a response. You might have better luck.
Steve Sundquist
Kit #48
On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 12:39 AM, Bill Strahan <bill(at)gdsx.com (bill(at)gdsx.com)> wrote:
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[quote][b]
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Bill Strahan
Joined: 20 Aug 2008
Posts: 145
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| Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 9:22 pm Post subject: Re: Modified long wing tips |
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| sttwig wrote: | That was done by Green Landings.� I inquired about the process and didn't get a response.� You might have better luck.
�
Steve Sundquist
Kit #48
[b] |
I sent an email to them, but have not heard back. I can see many ways of doing it, just would like to see some pictures of the process if possible.
I'm sure Green Landings is proud of their process, but I wouldn't think this is an element of intellectual property that really would make the decision on which center you would choose.
When I do it I'll share some pictures. Unless I butcher it. Then I'll just ask for sympathy. 
Bill
| | - The Matronics Lightning-List Email Forum - | | | Use the List Feature Navigator to browse the many List utilities available such as the Email Subscriptions page, Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ, Photoshare, and much more:
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Kayberg(at)aol.com
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| Posted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 12:05 pm Post subject: Modified long wing tips |
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In a message dated 11/12/2009 12:23:28 AM Eastern Standard Time, bill(at)gdsx.com writes:
| Quote: | I sent an email to them, but have not heard back. I can see many ways of doing it, just would like to see some pictures of the process if possible.
I'm sure Green Landings is proud of their process, but I wouldn't think this is an element of intellectual property that really would make the decision on which center you would choose.
When I do it I'll share some pictures. Unless I butcher it. Then I'll just ask for sympathy.
Bill
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I talked to Ryan today and he is looking for pictures of how he does the wingtips. Not sure he has any. If he does he plans to post them.
It is not about intellectual property as much as trying to offer perks to those who pay for a facility and advice. Build centers need income to stay in business and many of the techniques come at a price. Someone has to put in the hours at some expense to perfect the ways to do things. The folks at Shelbyville profit from selling kits, so it is in their best interest to make the kits as easy to build as possible. So they spend the money on developing a manual and their techniques. Green Landings only gets a slice of their pie when it comes to kit sales and needs to make additional money somehow.
Individual builders are doing it for fun. Easy for them to share. But when you feed your kids by selling airplane kits, trying to be the best build center and offering the best of design improvements; it is a little tougher to give away your ideas.
Doug
[quote][b]
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Bill Strahan
Joined: 20 Aug 2008
Posts: 145
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| Posted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 5:28 pm Post subject: Re: Modified long wing tips |
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"...a little tougher to give away your ideas."
Doug, sounds like intellectual property to me.
I wasn't trying to be negative by characterizing it that way. If someone came calling asking me how I did specific things in my software business, in particular things that differentiate us within our industry, I would not be willing to share that. I would be giving away IP at that point.
I was simply thinking that this particular modification didn't strike me as particularly valuable across the market of potential builders, and a great deal of the value is in the work itself, not the knowledge of how to do it.
Perhaps I'm wrong. If so, it won't be a hallmark moment, it's happened before.
It's certainly Ryan's choice as to what he shares.
So, back to the topic at hand. At this point, I'm thinking I'll take the tips and cut them to the size I want for my plane. Then I'll split them along the leading edge so they can open up to take up some of the difference between the smaller airfoil that will exist at the point I cut them compared to end of the wing.
Then I'll bond a 4 strip thick layer of fiberglass about 2" wide to the inside of the cut down tip to create the flange that will allow me to attach it to the end of the wing. I'll attach it in place with screws, and have a big gap in the front that I will fill with a block of easily sandable foam. I'll wrap the end of the wing with some old .016 aluminum I have laying around to protect it, and then sand the leading edge to shape.
Remove all of that from the wing, sand the foam down about a 1/16 and then 3 layers of glass over that. Sand. Fill. Sand. Fill...etc.
If that description makes sense, any feedback on it?
Bill
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Kayberg(at)AOL.COM
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| Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 5:04 am Post subject: Modified long wing tips |
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In a message dated 11/12/2009 8:29:38 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, bill(at)gdsx.com writes:
| Quote: | --> Lightning-List message posted by: "Bill Strahan" <bill(at)gdsx.com>
"...a little tougher to give away your ideas."
Doug, sounds like intellectual property to me.
I wasn't trying to be negative by characterizing it that way. If someone came calling asking me how I did specific things in my software business, in particular things that differentiate us within our industry, I would not be willing to share that. I would be giving away IP at that point.
I was simply thinking that this particular modification didn't strike me as particularly valuable across the market of potential builders, and a great deal of the value is in the work itself, not the knowledge of how to do it.
Perhaps I'm wrong. If so, it won't be a hallmark moment, it's happened before.
It's certainly Ryan's choice as to what he shares |
Bill, you are more than kind.
I will bug Ryan to respond to you, a couple pictures would be worth a thousand words in this case.
I did not work on the two sets of tips that have been done so far. Your approach is completely different that what Ryan did. Might work better...who knows. But within a couple weeks Ryan has another set to do for his demo plane, you could also wait to see a few pix from that. You might contact him privately at ryan(at)greenlandings.com (ryan(at)greenlandings.com).
Doug
[quote][b]
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