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Cowl fasteners

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Tdawson(at)avidyne.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 6:27 am Post subject: Cowl fasteners

Where are people coming down on the decision of sticking with Van's cowl

"hinge" design, or going with Cam-lok type cowl fasteners?



Of the flying folks, anyone like to comment on the ease of use of the

hinge fastener design?



Thanks,



TDT

40025

flysrv10(at)gmail.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 6:55 am Post subject: Cowl fasteners

I have had the hinges on my RV6 for 12 years,  I would not trade them

with Cam-loks.  The installation and operation of the hinges for RV10

is even easier due to the larger diameter cowl.



Do not archive.



On 4/18/06, Tim Dawson-Townsend <Tdawson(at)avidyne.com> wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 Where are people coming down on the decision of sticking with Van's cowl

 "hinge" design, or going with Cam-lok type cowl fasteners?



 Of the flying folks, anyone like to comment on the ease of use of the

 hinge fastener design?



 Thanks,



 TDT

 40025

Tim(at)MyRV10.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 7:23 am Post subject: Cowl fasteners

I was originally a big proponent of the concept of switching

to Camloc's.  I didn't, because that would have slowed down

my build while trying to figure out exactly how I wanted to

do it, using the skybolt set, or smaller ones, and how many

and for how much cost.  They aren't cheap, but they are

convenient.



Now that I've had my cowl on and off a few times, I can comment

better on the hinges though.



I'm very surprised at how easy it is to deal with the hinges.

The top ones you just loosen the holding bracket and pull

the pins, very quick.  The horizontal ones are a simple

straight-in and out, very easy.  The bottom cowl side pins

are also pretty simple.  I did NOT go with lower pins,

but used nutplates and screws due to a large number of comments

on other RV's about how the eyelits wear on the hinges.

I'm glad I went the route I did for future issues.

So the cowl is very easy to remove and re-install, in regards

to the hinge pins.  I do get a little black streaking coming

out my cowl seam from the aluminum of the hinges.  I don't

know that it will get better, or worse, over time, but I'm

sure there will eventually be more play in the hinges.  Long-term

I can see the hinges possibly being an issue for wear, and

replacing them might not be fun, and would maybe require a

cowl repaint.  But I think it would be a long time to get

to that point of wear.



As far as the cowl going on and off, the lower cowl is

a real pain.  There isn't much clearance to get it up and down,

with the spinner installed, and the FAB/inlet stuff isn't fun to

align and keeps the cowl from going on smoothly.  It's a hard

job to do the lower cowl alone without banging things up....I

just did it yesterday.  The top one is simple.   I did

just change oil again too, with the lower cowl on.  You have

to protect your hands from the hot crankcase and exhaust, but

it's definitely do-able with a quick-disconnect.  I got a set

from ACS that had the valve and a matching latch-on hose

that works really well, and was pretty cheap I think.



For those deciding on props, you may have noticed the post

today regarding the 3 blade aerocomposite prop and it being

hard to remove and replace the lower cowl.  I personally

haven't done a 3-blade, but I can definitely see the

issue.  Even with my 2-blade, I have to make sure my

blades are horizontal or it can be a bear getting the cowl

off and on again.  I can't even imagine how it would

be with 3 blades, although I'm sure it's something

that 3-blade owners will manage fine.  I'm betting that

if 3-blade owners gave an honest statement, they'd

say that cowl removal sucks, but they love the prop. I'd

be suspicious if someone just says "no problem, easy"...

just call a spade a spade....doesn't mean the prop, or

the choice in props was bad.  Just means there's a little

more story to go along with it.



So all in all, I'm more happy with the hinges than I

thought I'd be, although I recognize that some day

I might have to repaint the cowl after a hinge repair.

The cowl definitely looks the best with hinges, but

camlocs aren't awful looking either...just don't

try to paint them.

Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying

do not archive

Tim Dawson-Townsend wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 

 Where are people coming down on the decision of sticking with Van's cowl

 "hinge" design, or going with Cam-lok type cowl fasteners?

 

 Of the flying folks, anyone like to comment on the ease of use of the

 hinge fastener design?

 

 Thanks,

 

 TDT

 40025

Jack.Phillips(at)cardinal
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 7:42 am Post subject: Cowl fasteners

I haven't yet started on my RV-10, but I can add to what Tim said about

the hinges.  My RV-4 has the same type of cowling design, with piano

hinges.  It has been flying since 1989 and the hinges have not shown any

appreciable wear.  I concur with Tim that the bottom cowl is a real pain

to install by yourself, but with help it is not too bad.  Unfortunately,

with the cheek cowls of the RV-4, it is not an option to leave the lower

cowl in place for oil changes - just not enough room to work.



Jack Phillips

Raleigh, NC



--

jesse(at)itecusa.org
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 7:48 am Post subject: Cowl fasteners

I second almost all of this.  We put in nutplates and screw on the top cowl.

While it is simple and anybody can figure out how to do it easily, it is a

pain in the neck to take off all those screws.  I think it looks kind of

cool with all of the SS screws and counter sunk washers, but it would look

cool with nothing too.  We use the pins on the lower cowl and wouldn't

change that.  On this one we are going pins just like the plans say, the

whole way.  The bottom cowl is a bear and a half to get off, especially with

the front gear leg fairing installed.  We should have left more of a gap

between the baffles and the cowl and possibly between the airbox and the

cowl.  We change the oil with the bottom cowl on, with a quick drain from

Van's, but it would be nice if the bottom cowl came off easier.  I also

couldn't imagine trying to do it with a 3-blade, but the plane looks better

with 3 blades and flies smoother.  There are pros and cons to just about

everything.



Do not archive.



Jesse Saint

I-TEC, Inc.

jesse(at)itecusa.org

www.itecusa.org

352-465-4545



--

10flyer(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 9:15 am Post subject: Cowl fasteners

Hey Tim, I have the Camloc system on my 10. The big advantage is that I can 

easily put on/ take off top and bottom cowl by myself. I can also do it in a 

matter of minutes. Disadvantages are obviously the cost, not as clean 

looking, and almost impossible not to eventually get a little scalloping 

between the camlocs around the firewall. I never have used pins before, but 

I can tell you the other guy on the field with a 10 has them and needs help 

putting the cowl on due to its size. He definately has a cleaner look!!

Tim(at)MyRV10.com
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 9:53 am Post subject: Cowl fasteners

I don't follow one thing though.... You said you have an easy

time doing the top AND bottom cowl by yourself.   I can't

see what would make it significant in regards to the pins

though.....it seems like the actual pinning or camloc

twisting is the easy part...the hard part is just getting that

bottom cowl up in place between the prop and engine, under

that rear cowl bracket, next to the gear leg, and have

it all line up.



Or did you do something unique and have a lower cowl mod

that makes it easier to get on an off?  I'm just not sure

what I'm missing.



Tim Olson - RV-10 N104CD - Flying

do not archive

Mark Chamberlain wrote:

 	  Quote: 	
		   

 

 Hey Tim, I have the Camloc system on my 10. The big advantage is that I 

 can easily put on/ take off top and bottom cowl by myself. I can also do 

 it in a matter of minutes. Disadvantages are obviously the cost, not as 

 clean looking, and almost impossible not to eventually get a little 

 scalloping between the camlocs around the firewall. I never have used 

 pins before, but I can tell you the other guy on the field with a 10 has 

 them and needs help putting the cowl on due to its size. He definately 

 has a cleaner look!!

Rick S.

Joined: 12 Feb 2006
Posts: 347
Location: Las Vegas

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 2:04 pm Post subject: Cowl fasteners

Take a peek at Randy Lervold's site, he is using the SKybolt C-loks. I am leaning this way although not flying yet. He specs out the correct PN's of the recepticles, studs etc. I think they are a better but albeit a tad more expensive than the hinge route.



Heres a link:



http://www.romeolima.com/RV3works/Airframe/airframe.htm



I really like the way they look and should outlast the hinges without any problem.



Rick S.

40185

Fuse/Finish

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_________________
Rick S.
RV-10
40185

10flyer(at)verizon.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 4:12 pm Post subject: Cowl fasteners

Maybe this is specific to how my cowl worked out, but once I've posisitioned 

the bottom half ( It sorta hangs on the baffle material around the air box) 

I can easily fasten the top camloc on each side of the bottom cowl. It then 

hangs by itself.  Now it is a simple task to position the top and then go 

through a sequence of fastening each camloc with a quarter turn. Of course I 

still have the screws on either side of the spinner and under the cowl near 

the fuselage. Mark

Randy(at)abros.com
Guest

Posted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 8:37 am Post subject: Cowl fasteners

I would not change from that factory setup.  It has been flawless, easy

to install and remove. Randy



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