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jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com
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 Posted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 7:13 am Post subject: ethanol |
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Appreciate some info concerning fuel seperation. I have CH701 with the 100hp riotax. I live in a high humedity area and have not been flying much lately. I use 10% ethanol fuel and last time I started to fly (fuel had been in A/C over a month) and checked the lowest drain, I found cloudy fuel, not water, but did not lood good. I continued to drain fuel until it was clear, probably a half an ounce. Was this cloudy fuel on the point of seperation? I did go ahead and fly with no problems, but after thinking about it, what would the list's ideas be. Very glad it kept running, though an both tanks the fuel seemed to come out of only one tank. No external fuel pump. Gravity feed.
==========
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flyadive(at)gmail.com
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| Posted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:04 am Post subject: ethanol |
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Joe:
There are a few things that would cause your fuel to go cloudy:
Contamination in the tank.
Hygroscopic action of the alcohol
Temperature (low) causing the water to freeze
Being that you found only 1/2 ounce I would also consider:
The drain plugs as being contaminated due to oxidation
How clean was the inspection tube that you were using
When you say 'separation', are you referring to the water separating out from the fuel due to saturation? If yes, then YES you could be seeing the water above what the alcohol would hold in suspension.
A 1/2 ounce... I would not worry about. But why use gas with ethanol - Do the separation procedure that has been discussed here on line and you will reduce the chances of water.
Barry
On Mon, Feb 7, 2011 at 10:10 AM, Joe and Joan Kimbell <jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com (jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com)> wrote:
[quote] Appreciate some info concerning fuel seperation. I have CH701 with the 100hp riotax. I live in a high humedity area and have not been flying much lately. I use 10% ethanol fuel and last time I started to fly (fuel had been in A/C over a month) and checked the lowest drain, I found cloudy fuel, not water, but did not lood good. I continued to drain fuel until it was clear, probably a half an ounce. Was this cloudy fuel on the point of seperation? I did go ahead and fly with no problems, but after thinking about it, what would the list's ideas be. Very glad it kept running, though an both tanks the fuel seemed to come out of only one tank. No external fuel pump. Gravity feed.
==========
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ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List
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jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com
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| Posted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 12:08 pm Post subject: ethanol |
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Barry, Sorry, I meant to say one half pint. Have no idea what Hygroscopic action means. Live in central FL and keep A/C in hangar. Un likly temp ever went down to 32 in hangar. Yes, I mean separating due to saturation. I am aware of the separation discussed and felt that someone who had done this would know if there was a period of cloudy looking just prior to separation. Thanks, Joe
Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2011 12:59:23 -0500
Subject: Re: ethanol
From: flyadive(at)gmail.com
To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com
Joe:
There are a few things that would cause your fuel to go cloudy:
Contamination in the tank.
Hygroscopic action of the alcohol
Temperature (low) causing the water to freeze
Being that you found only 1/2 ounce I would also consider:
The drain plugs as being contaminated due to oxidation
How clean was the inspection tube that you were using
When you say 'separation', are you referring to the water separating out from the fuel due to saturation? If yes, then YES you could be seeing the water above what the alcohol would hold in suspension.
A 1/2 ounce... I would not worry about. But why use gas with ethanol - Do the separation procedure that has been discussed here on line and you will reduce the chances of water.
Barry
On Mon, Feb 7, 2011 at 10:10 AM, Joe and Joan Kimbell <jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com (jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com)> wrote:
[quote] Appreciate some info concerning fuel seperation. I have CH701 with the 100hp riotax. I live in a high humedity area and have not been flying much lately. I use 10% ethanol fuel and last time I started to fly (fuel had been in A/C over a month) and checked the lowest drain, I found cloudy fuel, not water, but did not lood good. I continued to drain fuel until it was clear, probably a half an ounce. Was this cloudy fuel on the point of seperation? I did go ahead and fly with no problems, but after thinking about it, what would the list's ideas be. Very glad it kept running, though an both tanks the fuel seemed to come out of only one tank. No external fuel pump. Gravity feed.
==========
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ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List
tp://forums.matronics.com
_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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-List" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List
ttp://forums.matronics.com
=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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flyadive(at)gmail.com
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daberti(at)sbcglobal.net
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| Posted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 5:25 pm Post subject: ethanol |
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You can get cloudy looking fuel if you used additives in your fuel. Some things when mixed with water will cloud up when agitated, It's possible that the stuff sank with the water into your sump.
[quote]
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Float Flyr
Joined: 19 Jul 2006
Posts: 2704
Location: Campbellton, Newfoundland
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| Posted: Mon Feb 07, 2011 6:28 pm Post subject: ethanol |
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If you really, really have to fly on ethanol fuel then you have already broken the first cardinal rule. Never leave fuel in your plane for an extended period of time. If you have high humidity, as you said, it will absorb some of the moisture and when that happens it, not only gets closer to a phase separation but becomes very corrosive.... It may eat your tanks if they are anything but stainless steel. It will probably start to eat your fuel system including the carb body and the fuel lines. Best not to leave it in the plane and only fly on fresh fuel. BTW you will know when you have a phase separation happening... you will get something just over 10% of the quantity of fuel in your tank showing up as water. So if you have left say 15 gal of fuel in your plane then if it separates you will get 1.5 gallons of water/ethanol solution (mostly water) hitting your carb or injectors. A little good news is if you are using a paper filter it will try to block the water from passing... unfortunately there won’t be anything else but water to pass. The milky substance you did find is probably something the ethanol started to eat.
The second point is as Barry mentioned remove the ethanol form your fuel by adding enough water to cause a phase separation. Then siphon the clear ethanol free gas off the top of the water ethanol solution that will form on the bottom of the container. Be careful though, to let the gas sit for about twenty minutes so all the water can settle out before siphoning the gas. And always use a good chamois or felt to strain your gas... either of those products will pass gas but not water. If you remove the ethanol from your fuel then it won’t hurt to leave the gas in your plane between flights for periods of up to I guess a month or so.
Noel
From: owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of FLYaDIVE
Sent: February 7, 2011 2:29 PM
To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: ethanol
Joe:
There are a few things that would cause your fuel to go cloudy:
Contamination in the tank.
Hygroscopic action of the alcohol
Temperature (low) causing the water to freeze
Being that you found only 1/2 ounce I would also consider:
The drain plugs as being contaminated due to oxidation
How clean was the inspection tube that you were using
When you say 'separation', are you referring to the water separating out from the fuel due to saturation? If yes, then YES you could be seeing the water above what the alcohol would hold in suspension.
A 1/2 ounce... I would not worry about. But why use gas with ethanol - Do the separation procedure that has been discussed here on line and you will reduce the chances of water.
Barry
On Mon, Feb 7, 2011 at 10:10 AM, Joe and Joan Kimbell <jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com (jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com)> wrote:
Appreciate some info concerning fuel seperation. I have CH701 with the 100hp riotax. I live in a high humedity area and have not been flying much lately. I use 10% ethanol fuel and last time I started to fly (fuel had been in A/C over a month) and checked the lowest drain, I found cloudy fuel, not water, but did not lood good. I continued to drain fuel until it was clear, probably a half an ounce. Was this cloudy fuel on the point of seperation? I did go ahead and fly with no problems, but after thinking about it, what would the list's ideas be. Very glad it kept running, though an both tanks the fuel seemed to come out of only one tank. No external fuel pump. Gravity feed.
==========
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[quote][b]
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Noel Loveys
Kitfox III-A
Aerocet 1100 Floats |
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jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com
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| Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 4:59 am Post subject: ethanol |
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GENTLEMEN: Thank you for your input. I have found a source for 90 oct. ethanol free fuel for about 50 cents a gal. over pump price. sounds like a good deal to me. After following all of the excellent suggestions. I am switching to the ethanol free fuel. Wish it was available for everyone. Thanks again, Joe
From: noelloveys(at)yahoo.ca
To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: ethanol
Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2011 22:53:28 -0330
.ExternalClass p.ecxMsoNormal, .ExternalClass li.ecxMsoNormal, .ExternalClass div.ecxMsoNormal {margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:12.0pt;font-family:'Times New Roman','serif';} .ExternalClass a:link, .ExternalClass span.ecxMsoHyperlink {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;} .ExternalClass a:visited, .ExternalClass span.ecxMsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;} .ExternalClass pre {margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:10.0pt;font-family:'Courier New';} .ExternalClass span.ecxHTMLPreformattedChar {font-family:Consolas;} .ExternalClass span.ecxEmailStyle19 {font-family:'Times New Roman','serif';color:windowtext;} .ExternalClass .ecxMsoChpDefault {;} (at)page WordSection1 {size:612.0pt 792.0pt;} .ExternalClass div.ecxWordSection1 {page:WordSection1;}
If you really, really have to fly on ethanol fuel then you have already broken the first cardinal rule. Never leave fuel in your plane for an extended period of time. If you have high humidity, as you said, it will absorb some of the moisture and when that happens it, not only gets closer to a phase separation but becomes very corrosive.... It may eat your tanks if they are anything but stainless steel. It will probably start to eat your fuel system including the carb body and the fuel lines. Best not to leave it in the plane and only fly on fresh fuel. BTW you will know when you have a phase separation happening... you will get something just over 10% of the quantity of fuel in your tank showing up as water. So if you have left say 15 gal of fuel in your plane then if it separates you will get 1.5 gallons of water/ethanol solution (mostly water) hitting your carb or injectors. A little good news is if you are using a paper filter it will try to block the water from passing... unfortunately there won’t be anything else but water to pass. The milky substance you did find is probably something the ethanol started to eat.
The second point is as Barry mentioned remove the ethanol form your fuel by adding enough water to cause a phase separation. Then siphon the clear ethanol free gas off the top of the water ethanol solution that will form on the bottom of the container. Be careful though, to let the gas sit for about twenty minutes so all the water can settle out before siphoning the gas. And always use a good chamois or felt to strain your gas... either of those products will pass gas but not water. If you remove the ethanol from your fuel then it won’t hurt to leave the gas in your plane between flights for periods of up to I guess a month or so.
Noel
From: owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of FLYaDIVE
Sent: February 7, 2011 2:29 PM
To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: ethanol
Joe:
There are a few things that would cause your fuel to go cloudy:
Contamination in the tank.
Hygroscopic action of the alcohol
Temperature (low) causing the water to freeze
Being that you found only 1/2 ounce I would also consider:
The drain plugs as being contaminated due to oxidation
How clean was the inspection tube that you were using
When you say 'separation', are you referring to the water separating out from the fuel due to saturation? If yes, then YES you could be seeing the water above what the alcohol would hold in suspension.
A 1/2 ounce... I would not worry about. But why use gas with ethanol - Do the separation procedure that has been discussed here on line and you will reduce the chances of water.
Barry
On Mon, Feb 7, 2011 at 10:10 AM, Joe and Joan Kimbell <jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com (jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com)> wrote:
Appreciate some info concerning fuel seperation. I have CH701 with the 100hp riotax. I live in a high humedity area and have not been flying much lately. I use 10% ethanol fuel and last time I started to fly (fuel had been in A/C over a month) and checked the lowest drain, I found cloudy fuel, not water, but did not lood good. I continued to drain fuel until it was clear, probably a half an ounce. Was this cloudy fuel on the point of seperation? I did go ahead and fly with no problems, but after thinking about it, what would the list's ideas be. Very glad it kept running, though an both tanks the fuel seemed to come out of only one tank. No external fuel pump. Gravity feed.
==========
| Quote: |
| Quote: | | ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-Listtp://forums.matronics.com_blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution |
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0123456789 | Quote: | | ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List |
0 | Quote: | | ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List |
1 | Quote: | | ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List |
2 | Quote: | | ist" target="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?RotaxEngines-List |
3
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4 [quote][b]
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dirtfly7(at)yahoo.com
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| Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:36 am Post subject: ethanol |
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http://pure-gas.org/index.jsp?stateprov=ID
--- On Tue, 2/8/11, Joe and Joan Kimbell <jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com> wrote:
| Quote: |
From: Joe and Joan Kimbell <jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: ethanol
To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com
Date: Tuesday, February 8, 2011, 5:55 AM
GENTLEMEN: Thank you for your input. I have found a source for 90 oct. ethanol free fuel for about 50 cents a gal. over pump price. sounds like a good deal to me. After following all of the excellent suggestions. I am switching to the ethanol free fuel. Wish it was available for everyone. Thanks again, Joe
From: noelloveys(at)yahoo.ca
To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: ethanol
Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2011 22:53:28 -0330
#yiv225431252 .yiv225431252ExternalClass p.yiv225431252ecxMsoNormal, #yiv225431252 .yiv225431252ExternalClass li.yiv225431252ecxMsoNormal, #yiv225431252 .yiv225431252ExternalClass div.yiv225431252ecxMsoNormal {margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:12.0pt;font-family:'serif';} #yiv225431252 .yiv225431252ExternalClass a:link, #yiv225431252 .yiv225431252ExternalClass span.yiv225431252ecxMsoHyperlink {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;} #yiv225431252 .yiv225431252ExternalClass a:visited, #yiv225431252 .yiv225431252ExternalClass span.yiv225431252ecxMsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;} #yiv225431252 .yiv225431252ExternalClass pre {margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:10.0pt;font-family:'Courier New';} #yiv225431252 .yiv225431252ExternalClass span.yiv225431252ecxHTMLPreformattedChar {font-family:Consolas;} #yiv225431252 .yiv225431252ExternalClass span.yiv225431252ecxEmailStyle19 {font-family:'serif';color:windowtext;} #yiv225431252 .yiv225431252ExternalClass .yiv225431252ecxMsoChpDefault {} _filtered #yiv225431252 {} #yiv225431252 .yiv225431252ExternalClass div.yiv225431252ecxWordSection1 {}
If you really, really have to fly on ethanol fuel then you have already broken the first cardinal rule. Never leave fuel in your plane for an extended period of time. If you have high humidity, as you said, it will absorb some of the moisture and when that happens it, not only gets closer to a phase separation but becomes very corrosive.... It may eat your tanks if they are anything but stainless steel. It will probably start to eat your fuel system including the carb body and the fuel lines. Best not to leave it in the plane and only fly on fresh fuel. BTW you will know when you have a phase separation happening... you will get something just over 10% of the quantity of fuel in your tank showing up as water. So if you have left say 15 gal of fuel in your plane then if it separates you will get 1.5 gallons of water/ethanol solution (mostly water) hitting your carb or injectors. A little good news is if you are using a paper filter it will try to block the water from passing... unfortunately there won’t be anything else but water to pass. The milky substance you did find is probably something the ethanol started to eat.
The second point is as Barry mentioned remove the ethanol form your fuel by adding enough water to cause a phase separation. Then siphon the clear ethanol free gas off the top of the water ethanol solution that will form on the bottom of the container. Be careful though, to let the gas sit for about twenty minutes so all the water can settle out before siphoning the gas. And always use a good chamois or felt to strain your gas... either of those products will pass gas but not water. If you remove the ethanol from your fuel then it won’t hurt to leave the gas in your plane between flights for periods of up to I guess a month or so.
Noel
From: owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of FLYaDIVE
Sent: February 7, 2011 2:29 PM
To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Re: ethanol
Joe:
There are a few things that would cause your fuel to go cloudy:
Contamination in the tank.
Hygroscopic action of the alcohol
Temperature (low) causing the water to freeze
Being that you found only 1/2 ounce I would also consider:
The drain plugs as being contaminated due to oxidation
How clean was the inspection tube that you were using
When you say 'separation', are you referring to the water separating out from the fuel due to saturation? If yes, then YES you could be seeing the water above what the alcohol would hold in suspension.
A 1/2 ounce... I would not worry about. But why use gas with ethanol - Do the separation procedure that has been discussed here on line and you will reduce the chances of water.
Barry
On Mon, Feb 7, 2011 at 10:10 AM, Joe and Joan Kimbell <[url=/mc/compose?to=jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com]jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com[/url]> wrote:
Appreciate some info concerning fuel seperation. I have CH701 with the 100hp riotax. I live in a high humedity area and have not been flying much lately. I use 10% ethanol fuel and last time I started to fly (fuel had been in A/C over a month) and checked the lowest drain, I found cloudy fuel, not water, but did not lood good. I continued to drain fuel until it was clear, probably a half an ounce. Was this cloudy fuel on the point of seperation? I did go ahead and fly with no problems, but after thinking about it, what would the list's ideas be. Very glad it kept running, though an both tanks the fuel seemed to come out of only one tank. No external fuel pump. Gravity feed.
==========
| Quote: |
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pchristensen10(at)austin.
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| Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:36 am Post subject: ethanol |
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There is a great survey about avgas/mogas. Go here if interested. It's worth a couple minutes.
[url=http://www.questionpro.com/akira/TakeSurvey?id 34975]http://www.questionpro.com/akira/TakeSurvey?id 34975[/url]
Pete
Kitfox III, 912
On 2/16/2011 6:30 AM, Joel M. wrote: [quote] http://pure-gas.org/index.jsp?stateprov=ID
--- On Tue, 2/8/11, Joe and Joan Kimbell <jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com> (jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com) wrote:
| Quote: |
From: Joe and Joan Kimbell <jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com> (jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com)
Subject: RE: ethanol
To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com (rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com)
Date: Tuesday, February 8, 2011, 5:55 AM
Â
GENTLEMEN: Thank you for your input. I have found a source for 90 oct. ethanol free fuel for about 50 cents a gal. over pump price. sounds like a good deal to me. After following all of the excellent suggestions. I am switching to the ethanol free fuel. Wish it was available for everyone.   Thanks again, Joe
Â
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From: noelloveys(at)yahoo.ca (noelloveys(at)yahoo.ca)
To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com (rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: RE: ethanol
Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2011 22:53:28 -0330
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If you really, really have to fly on ethanol fuel then you have already broken the first cardinal rule. Never leave fuel in your plane for an extended period of time. If you have high humidity, as you said,  it will absorb some of the moisture and when that happens it, not only gets closer to a phase separation but becomes very corrosive.... It may eat your tanks if they are anything but stainless steel. It will probably start to eat your fuel system including the carb body and the fuel lines. Best not to leave it in the plane and only fly on fresh fuel. BTW you will know when you have a phase separation happening... you will get something just over 10% of the quantity of fuel in your tank showing up as water. So if you have left say 15 gal of fuel in your plane then if it separates you will get 1.5 gallons of water/ethanol solution (mostly water) hitting your carb or injectors. A little good news is if you are using a paper filter it will try to block the water from passing... unfortunately there won’t be anything else but water to pass. The milky substance you did find is probably something the ethanol started to eat.
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The second point is as Barry mentioned remove the ethanol form your fuel by adding enough water to cause a phase separation. Then siphon the clear ethanol free gas off the top of the water ethanol solution that will form on the bottom of the container. Be careful though, to let the gas sit for about twenty minutes so all the water can settle out before siphoning the gas. And always use a good chamois or felt to strain your gas... either of those products will pass gas but not water.  If you remove the ethanol from your fuel then it won’t hurt to leave the gas in your plane between flights for periods of up to I guess a month or so.
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Noel
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From: owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of FLYaDIVE
Sent: February 7, 2011 2:29 PM
To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com (rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: ethanol
Â
Joe:
Â
There are a few things that would cause your fuel to go cloudy:
Contamination in the tank.
Hygroscopic action of the alcohol
Temperature (low) causing the water to freeze
Â
Being that you found only 1/2 ounce I would also consider:
The drain plugs as being contaminated due to oxidation
How clean was the inspection tube that you were using
Â
When you say 'separation', are you referring to the water separating out from the fuel due to saturation?  If yes, then YES you could be seeing the water above what the alcohol would hold in suspension.
Â
A 1/2 ounce... I would not worry about.  But why use gas with ethanol - Do the separation procedure that has been discussed here on line and you will reduce the chances of water.
Â
Barry
On Mon, Feb 7, 2011 at 10:10 AM, Joe and Joan Kimbell <[url=/mc/compose?to=jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com]jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com[/url]> wrote:
Appreciate some info concerning fuel seperation. I have CH701 with the 100hp riotax. I live in a high humedity area and have not been flying much lately. I use 10%  ethanol fuel and last time I started to fly (fuel had been in A/C over a month) and checked the lowest drain, I found cloudy fuel, not water, but did not lood good. I continued to drain fuel until it was clear, probably a half an ounce. Was this cloudy fuel on the point of seperation? I did go ahead and fly with no problems, but after thinking about it, what would the list's ideas be. Very glad it kept running, though an both tanks the fuel seemed to come out of only one tank. No external fuel pump. Gravity feed.
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gpabruce(at)gmail.com
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| Posted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 11:11 am Post subject: ethanol |
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Sorry that I got in on this thread late. Can anyone direct me to the entire thread please? Thanks, Bruce
On Wed, Feb 16, 2011 at 4:30 AM, Joel M. <dirtfly7(at)yahoo.com (dirtfly7(at)yahoo.com)> wrote:
[quote] http://pure-gas.org/index.jsp?stateprov=ID
--- On Tue, 2/8/11, Joe and Joan Kimbell <jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com (jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com)> wrote:
| Quote: |
From: Joe and Joan Kimbell <jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com (jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com)>
Subject: RE: ethanol
To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com (rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com)
Date: Tuesday, February 8, 2011, 5:55 AM
GENTLEMEN: Thank you for your input. I have found a source for 90 oct. ethanol free fuel for about 50 cents a gal. over pump price. sounds like a good deal to me. After following all of the excellent suggestions. I am switching to the ethanol free fuel. Wish it was available for everyone. Thanks again, Joe
From: noelloveys(at)yahoo.ca (noelloveys(at)yahoo.ca)
To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com (rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: RE: RotaxEngines-List: ethanol
Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2011 22:53:28 -0330
If you really, really have to fly on ethanol fuel then you have already broken the first cardinal rule. Never leave fuel in your plane for an extended period of time. If you have high humidity, as you said, it will absorb some of the moisture and when that happens it, not only gets closer to a phase separation but becomes very corrosive.... It may eat your tanks if they are anything but stainless steel. It will probably start to eat your fuel system including the carb body and the fuel lines. Best not to leave it in the plane and only fly on fresh fuel. BTW you will know when you have a phase separation happening... you will get something just over 10% of the quantity of fuel in your tank showing up as water. So if you have left say 15 gal of fuel in your plane then if it separates you will get 1.5 gallons of water/ethanol solution (mostly water) hitting your carb or injectors. A little good news is if you are using a paper filter it will try to block the water from passing... unfortunately there won’t be anything else but water to pass. The milky substance you did find is probably something the ethanol started to eat.
The second point is as Barry mentioned remove the ethanol form your fuel by adding enough water to cause a phase separation. Then siphon the clear ethanol free gas off the top of the water ethanol solution that will form on the bottom of the container. Be careful though, to let the gas sit for about twenty minutes so all the water can settle out before siphoning the gas. And always use a good chamois or felt to strain your gas... either of those products will pass gas but not water. If you remove the ethanol from your fuel then it won’t hurt to leave the gas in your plane between flights for periods of up to I guess a month or so.
Noel
From: owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com) [mailto:owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com (owner-rotaxengines-list-server(at)matronics.com)] On Behalf Of FLYaDIVE
Sent: February 7, 2011 2:29 PM
To: rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com (rotaxengines-list(at)matronics.com)
Subject: Re: ethanol
Joe:
There are a few things that would cause your fuel to go cloudy:
Contamination in the tank.
Hygroscopic action of the alcohol
Temperature (low) causing the water to freeze
Being that you found only 1/2 ounce I would also consider:
The drain plugs as being contaminated due to oxidation
How clean was the inspection tube that you were using
When you say 'separation', are you referring to the water separating out from the fuel due to saturation? If yes, then YES you could be seeing the water above what the alcohol would hold in suspension.
A 1/2 ounce... I would not worry about. But why use gas with ethanol - Do the separation procedure that has been discussed here on line and you will reduce the chances of water.
Barry
On Mon, Feb 7, 2011 at 10:10 AM, Joe and Joan Kimbell <jnjkimbell(at)hotmail.com> wrote:
Appreciate some info concerning fuel seperation. I have CH701 with the 100hp riotax. I live in a high humedity area and have not been flying much lately. I use 10% ethanol fuel and last time I started to fly (fuel had been in A/C over a month) and checked the lowest drain, I found cloudy fuel, not water, but did not lood good. I continued to drain fuel until it was clear, probably a half an ounce. Was this cloudy fuel on the point of seperation? I did go ahead and fly with no problems, but after thinking about it, what would the list's ideas be. Very glad it kept running, though an both tanks the fuel seemed to come out of only one tank. No external fuel pump. Gravity feed.
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BUT - None of it was cloudy.
