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Navaid Servo

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dean.psiropoulos(at)veriz
Guest

Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 6:35 pm Post subject: Navaid Servo

Marcel:



Are you using the Navaid control head with it and do you have your servo set

up correctly on the ground.  Using the Navaid control head requires manual

adjustments (as opposed to electronic)and set up tasks. Check the manual for

servo and control head adjustments and read and re-read it carefully. I had

some confusion about some of the tasks that were best clarified by someone

familiar with the system.  Unfortunately Navaid no longer exists but there

are still many folks who have them in their aircraft so you may be in luck.



Before I finished my panel Trio Avionics had come out with a new digital

control head that worked with the three wire Navaid servo so I ditched the

old analog Navaid control head for an EZ Pilot (cost almost as much for the

control head as the entire Navaid system but definitely worth it). I have

everything set up and working properly on the ground but still experience a

slight problem with my Navaid servo.  When I engage the servo in flight I

get an initial one-time excursion to the left (left wing down ~20 degrees)

before things settle out and start working properly.  



Before I started using my EZ Pilot Chuck, at Trio Avionics, suggested I send

in my Navaid servo for a tune up. I did that and, for a very reasonable fee,

Trio performed some magic that cleaned up the slop in the mechanicals of the

servo.  However, when they tested the servo they found a common problem in

the electronics.  In talking with Chuck he mentioned one of the components,

a diode if I recall correctly, can sometimes cause the excursion that I

experience.  Unfortunately he couldn't fix it.



Which brings me to a question I have for the list....does anyone know who

made the Navaid servos and are there any drawings/specs/schematics available

for it?  Is there anyone or any company that still makes or repairs these

servos?  If so please let us know, the servos are pretty rugged but they

don't last forever and I would like to get rid of the excursion in mine.

Thanks



Dean

RV-6A N197DM

Flying since 2008 



---------

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bicyclop(at)pacbell.net
Guest

Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 9:58 pm Post subject: Navaid Servo

Howdy Dean,

       

       I've got the same setup in my 6A and experienced the same       excursion. I reset some of the parameters in the Trio and it       mostly went away. Been a long time and I don't remember exactly       what it was, but it seems like there was a couple of settings for       activity and sensitivity. Anyway, I tweaked it a couple of times       and test flew it a couple of times and cleared it up. If I engage       the servo to track to a waypoint, it still does a small excursion       and then lines up. I think it has something to do with the       sensitivity. Even if you are close to the centerline of the       course, it does a large correction to get you exactly on the       centerline and, naturally, overshoots. I usually just set it to       heading mode while I'm pointed the right direction and engage the       servo. It doesn't do any initial roll when I do it that way. 

       

       It once got very weird and tried to turn the airplane upside down       when I engaged it. I had to re-install the firmware to get it       straight. The guys at Trio said that it happens, rarely.       Apparently it has to do with shutting the power off at the exact       millisecond that it is writing parameters to memory and it gets       corrupted. Always a good idea to do a test engagement in good       visibility before you count on it in the clouds.

       

       Marcel,

       

       Dean is right about the manual setup on the Navaid. It's been a       long time since I messed with it, so I can't be very specific       about the procedure. You really need the manual. Do you have it?       You also have to verify that the wires don't need to be reversed.       If I understand it right, the servo doesn't sense arm position.       Everything comes from the head, so if the head thinks that it is       turning, it will command full opposite aileron until it thinks       that it is level. So if there is no roll, or roll in the wrong       direction, the head will go right on commanding roll. I don't know       for sure, but I don't think that the head is putting out the pwm       signal that you think it should. I believe that it basically just       runs the servo motor one direction or the       other until it thinks the airplane is wings level and/or tracking       the nav source. If the initial setup isn't       done right, it will act just as you are experiencing.

       

       Pax,

       

       Ed Holyoke

     

     On 8/16/2011 7:28 PM, DEAN PSIROPOULOS wrote:     [quote]       [quote]--> AeroElectric-List message posted by: "DEAN PSIROPOULOS" <dean.psiropoulos(at)verizon.net> (dean.psiropoulos(at)verizon.net)    Marcel:  Are you using the Navaid control head with it and do you have your servo set up correctly on the ground.  Using the Navaid control head requires manual adjustments (as opposed to electronic)and set up tasks. Check the manual for servo and control head adjustments and read and re-read it carefully. I had some confusion about some of the tasks that were best clarified by someone familiar with the system.  Unfortunately Navaid no longer exists but there are still many folks who have them in their aircraft so you may be in luck.  Before I finished my panel Trio Avionics had come out with a new digital control head that worked with the three wire Navaid servo so I ditched the old analog Navaid control head for an EZ Pilot (cost almost as much for the control head as the entire Navaid system but definitely worth it). I have everything set up and working properly on the ground but still experience a slight problem with my Navaid servo.  When I engage the servo in flight I get an initial one-time excursion to the left (left wing down ~20 degrees) before things settle out and start working properly.    Before I started using my EZ Pilot Chuck, at Trio Avionics, suggested I send in my Navaid servo for a tune up. I did that and, for a very reasonable fee, Trio performed some magic that cleaned up the slop in the mechanicals of the servo.  However, when they tested the servo they found a common problem in the electronics.  In talking with Chuck he mentioned one of the components, a diode if I recall correctly, can sometimes cause the excursion that I experience.  Unfortunately he couldn't fix it.  Which brings me to a question I have for the list....does anyone know who made the Navaid servos and are there any drawings/specs/schematics available for it?  Is there anyone or any company that still makes or repairs these servos?  If so please let us know, the servos are pretty rugged but they don't last forever and I would like to get rid of the excursion in mine. Thanks  Dean RV-6A N197DM Flying since 2008       ---------

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zwakie

Joined: 03 Aug 2009
Posts: 157

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 12:39 pm Post subject: Re: Navaid Servo

Dean,



Thanks for your elaborate reaction to my query. I have installed the Trio controlhead this week, so my setup is like yours now. The servo has been in place for years, and all of a sudden (about a year ago, so still having the Navaid controlhead) exhibited this full aileron deflection. 



Today I did some more analysis on the issue, the firm conclusion being that the servo has gone broke. I will either have to get a Navaid servo from somewhwere, or get myself a Trio servo. Given the fact that Navaid servos are getting into its dinosaur-state, I will most likely opt for the more modern Trio servo (which also has more safety features).



You can find a range of documents on the Navaid products at ftp://ftp.porcine.com/SmartCoupler/ - I believe there is a schematic there as well. hope this will help you resolving your issue.

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_________________
Marcel Zwakenberg
Europa XS TG || 912ULS || PH-SBR

Last edited by zwakie on Wed Aug 17, 2011 12:55 pm; edited 5 times in total

zwakie

Joined: 03 Aug 2009
Posts: 157

Posted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 12:51 pm Post subject: Re: Navaid Servo

Ed,



Thanks again for trying to help me out. Please accept my apologies for not having mentioned I am working on an existing installation of a servo that has performed flawlessly in the past. I guess what I'm saying is that alle the manual setups you are referring to have been done years ago.



FWIW: this week I took out the Navaid controlhead and replaced it with a Trio EZ Pilot controlhead. One reason, not the one driving this replacement though, was that for a little over a year the 'whole-Navaid-setup' started showing this weird behavior out of the blue. As I said in esponse to Dean, I will now most likely decide to have a servo from Trio; that way I will be completely up-to-date technology-wise...



Thanks,

Marcel

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_________________
Marcel Zwakenberg
Europa XS TG || 912ULS || PH-SBR

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