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kearney(at)shaw.ca
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 Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2006 4:51 pm Post subject: Priming - Sherwin Williams DTM |
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Hi All
A few weeks ago I asked about priming. After a lot of thought, I decided against most of the products currently in use primarily because I didn’t want to use really noxious chemicals in an attached garage. As well, volatile hydrocarbons may have been interesting to use in the presence of a natgas garage heater.
The product I decided to use is Sherwin Williams DTM (direct to metal) primer. It is water based and not as chemically interesting as other products. Today was day 2 of construction and my first experience with priming. I found the DTM easy to use with a standard air sprayer. Odor wise, it wasn’t all that bad although I did use a cartridge air mask just to be safe as it was too cold to do this outside. It takes only a couple of hours to dry and seems to be reasonably scratch resistant.
Can any of the primer experts on the list provide guidance as to how thick primer should be applied? Looking at the results of my work, it is apparent that I wasn’t consistent in the application. Some parts seemed to have a much heaver coat than others. On some parts the primer is translucent while on others it covers completely. My feeling is that I should go lighter rather than heavier but am not sure.
Comments? Suggestions?
Inquiring minds need to know …
Les Kearney
#40643 – Day 2 of long journey
[quote][b]
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AV8ORJWC
Joined: 13 Jul 2006
Posts: 1149
Location: Aurora, Oregon "Home of VANS"
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| Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2006 6:59 pm Post subject: Priming - Sherwin Williams DTM |
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The most tragic conclusion is finding that a specific selection of primer is not compatible for long term adhesion of the Top Coat selected later. The decisions need to go hand in hand.
Choose Wisely.
John Cox
#600
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Les Kearney
Sent: Tuesday, November 07, 2006 4:45 PM
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Priming - Sherwin Williams DTM
Hi All
A few weeks ago I asked about priming. After a lot of thought, I decided against most of the products currently in use primarily because I didn’t want to use really noxious chemicals in an attached garage. As well, volatile hydrocarbons may have been interesting to use in the presence of a natgas garage heater.
The product I decided to use is Sherwin Williams DTM (direct to metal) primer. It is water based and not as chemically interesting as other products. Today was day 2 of construction and my first experience with priming. I found the DTM easy to use with a standard air sprayer. Odor wise, it wasn’t all that bad although I did use a cartridge air mask just to be safe as it was too cold to do this outside. It takes only a couple of hours to dry and seems to be reasonably scratch resistant.
Can any of the primer experts on the list provide guidance as to how thick primer should be applied? Looking at the results of my work, it is apparent that I wasn’t consistent in the application. Some parts seemed to have a much heaver coat than others. On some parts the primer is translucent while on others it covers completely. My feeling is that I should go lighter rather than heavier but am not sure.
Comments? Suggestions?
Inquiring minds need to know …
Les Kearney
#40643 – Day 2 of long journey [quote] [b]
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kearney(at)shaw.ca
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| Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2006 10:10 pm Post subject: Priming - Sherwin Williams DTM |
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Hmmm
John, choosing wisely can be difficult if one is in the dark. From all I have been able to read, priming is a very dark art. That being said, my plan is to prime only interior components and to leave the exterior surfaces to the experts.
On the other hand, I do know a very good paint shop and perhaps will have a chat with them just to be sure….
Cheers
Les Kearney
RV10 # 40643 - Vertical Stab
Do not archive
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jjessen
Joined: 22 Apr 2006
Posts: 285
Location: OR
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| Posted: Wed Nov 08, 2006 9:11 am Post subject: Priming - Sherwin Williams DTM |
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Les, just make sure that the primer you use for the interior of the fuselage, which you might want to paint, is compatible with your paint. The rest of the interior can be whatever you want. It won't be painted.
John Jessen
#40328
| Quote: | From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Les Kearney
Sent: Tuesday, November 07, 2006 10:06 PM
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: Priming - Sherwin Williams DTM
Hmmm
John, choosing wisely can be difficult if one is in the dark. From all I have been able to read, priming is a very dark art. That being said, my plan is to prime only interior components and to leave the exterior surfaces to the experts.
On the other hand, I do know a very good paint shop and perhaps will have a chat with them just to be sure….
Cheers
Les Kearney
RV10 # 40643 - Vertical Stab
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of John W. Cox
Sent: Tuesday, November 07, 2006 7:57 PM
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: Priming - Sherwin Williams DTM
The most tragic conclusion is finding that a specific selection of primer is not compatible for long term adhesion of the Top Coat selected later. The decisions need to go hand in hand.
Choose Wisely.
John Cox
#600
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Les Kearney
Sent: Tuesday, November 07, 2006 4:45 PM
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: Priming - Sherwin Williams DTM
Hi All
A few weeks ago I asked about priming. After a lot of thought, I decided against most of the products currently in use primarily because I didn’t want to use really noxious chemicals in an attached garage. As well, volatile hydrocarbons may have been interesting to use in the presence of a natgas garage heater.
The product I decided to use is Sherwin Williams DTM (direct to metal) primer. It is water based and not as chemically interesting as other products. Today was day 2 of construction and my first experience with priming. I found the DTM easy to use with a standard air sprayer. Odor wise, it wasn’t all that bad although I did use a cartridge air mask just to be safe as it was too cold to do this outside. It takes only a couple of hours to dry and seems to be reasonably scratch resistant.
Can any of the primer experts on the list provide guidance as to how thick primer should be applied? Looking at the results of my work, it is apparent that I wasn’t consistent in the application. Some parts seemed to have a much heaver coat than others. On some parts the primer is translucent while on others it covers completely. My feeling is that I should go lighter rather than heavier but am not sure.
Comments? Suggestions?
Inquiring minds need to know …
Les Kearney
#40643 – Day 2 of long journey01234567890123456789012345678
9-- No virus found in this Edition. Release Date: 11/7/2006 |
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No virus found in this outgoing message.
11/7/2006
[quote][b]
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kearney(at)shaw.ca
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| Posted: Wed Nov 08, 2006 10:12 am Post subject: Priming - Sherwin Williams DTM |
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John
Thanks for the heads up. For the moment I am focused on the tail section. I am leaning towards a QB fuse / wings which I believe comes pre-primed. If I do go the with a slow build fuse your point becomes quite relevant. I hadn’t (at this point) really thought about painted surfaces in the cockpit area.
Cheers
Les Kearney
RV10 # 40643 - Vertical Stab
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armywrights(at)adelphia.n
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| Posted: Wed Nov 08, 2006 7:20 pm Post subject: Priming - Sherwin Williams DTM |
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Les,
The QB wings/fuse don’t come primed in the sense you are probably thinking. The bare metal is still visible, although there is some kind of viscous protectant on it, and is presumably sprayed on after assembly to protect it during shipment across the ocean. Some folks have thought of it as some kind of transparent conversion coating a la alodining. Regardless of what the QB assemblers use, I think all of us primer users are priming all the areas we can get to, including removing floor and side access panels just to help out that much more. A little scrub with scotchbrite and spirits makes it ready to prime. Interior surfaces intended for painting will require more prep from even this stage.
Rob Wright
#392
Tailcone attached tonight!
From: owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com [mailto:owner-rv10-list-server(at)matronics.com] On Behalf Of Les Kearney
Sent: Wednesday, November 08, 2006 12:08 PM
To: rv10-list(at)matronics.com
Subject: RE: Priming - Sherwin Williams DTM
John
Thanks for the heads up. For the moment I am focused on the tail section. I am leaning towards a QB fuse / wings which I believe comes pre-primed. If I do go the with a slow build fuse your point becomes quite relevant. I hadn’t (at this point) really thought about painted surfaces in the cockpit area.
Cheers
Les Kearney
RV10 # 40643 - Vertical Stab
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bsponcil(at)belinblank.or
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| Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2006 7:38 am Post subject: Priming - Sherwin Williams DTM |
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Where'd you get the SW DTM primer? I've been looking for something a little less caustic, particularly since winter is looming over the midwest and my garage door will have to be mostly closed from now until March.
I'm no expert but I think if you can't see underneath the primer, it's probably too thick. Unless you're planning to paint over it, you're goal is to put down an extra layer of corrosion protection. Ideally you want to achieve that aim with the minimum amount weight gain so the thinner the better - at least for parts that'll likely never be touched again.
-Brian
#40497
Iowa City, IA
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kearney(at)shaw.ca
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| Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2006 8:36 am Post subject: Priming - Sherwin Williams DTM |
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Brian
I think you are right about the thickness. I have only done a few parts so far (the vertical stab skeleton) so it is not really an issue – just a lesson learned. I plan to just “mist” parts from now on so that I just have a thin primer film.
I bought the paint from a Sherwin Williams outlet store. It is called SW DTM and can be found on their website at : http://makeashorterlink.com/?C1864622E
Cheers
Les Kearney
#40643 – Day 3 of long journey
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MChase(at)gdatp.com
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| Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2006 8:58 am Post subject: Priming - Sherwin Williams DTM |
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I was wondering what you did to prep before paint? I am getting ready to paint my VIirticle tail this weekend. I am using dipping in Alidine before applying a self etching primer called SME.
Michael Chase
40644
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kearney(at)shaw.ca
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| Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2006 3:49 pm Post subject: Priming - Sherwin Williams DTM |
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Michael
I was taught to just lightly scuff the surface with a scotchbrite pad and
then clean with lacquer thinner. I then sprayed on the primer.
Today I primed the VS & rudder skins. I used a fine mist on the sprayer. So
fine that I had to spray over each spot several times to get the desired
coverage. By doing this I was able to avoid too heavy a spray (which was
what happened during my first attempt at spraying).
The end result of today's effort is the skins are covered with a fine primer
film. I believe this is the intended result.
Cheers
Les Kearney
#40643 – Day 3 of long = journey
Do not archive
-----------------------------------------
I was wondering what you did to prep before paint? I am getting ready to
paint my VIirticle tail this weekend. I am using dipping in Alidine before
applying a self etching primer called SME.
Michael Chase
40644
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KiloPapa
Joined: 24 May 2006
Posts: 142
Location: Pearblossom, CA
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| Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2006 12:06 pm Post subject: Priming - Sherwin Williams DTM |
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| Quote: | | FYI - From Section 5 of Van's Construction Manual: "Van’s Aircraft does not have an “approved” primer. We use Sherwin Williams P60 G2. This is used on the QBs and prototypes made here. The QBs primer has no pigment so it just makes the interior surfaces slightly darker and lessshiny. In the US, this primer has a green tint, so the two will not match exactly. We use this primer because It isinexpensive, dries fast, and is easy to apply. Sherwin Williams will tell you that the primer needs a top coat. True,for optimum corrosion resistance, but Vans feels that this is not necessary for the way in which most owners willmaintain their RVs." Kevin40494tail/empennage |
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Kevin
40494
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